I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by OneWithTheAssassins on Fri Mar 08, 2013 5:46 am

noobcannon wrote:why didn't i get any cool IT foreshadowing in my tali romance scene? all i got was her was singing that stupid song. sounded like a cat going through the washing machine.
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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Guest on Fri Mar 08, 2013 5:47 am

noobcannon wrote:why didn't i get any cool IT foreshadowing in my tali romance scene? all i got was her was singing that stupid song. sounded like a cat going through the washing machine.

Just a crap mention of 'dawn' in the song.

Otherwise yeah, just screeching :P

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Hrothdane on Fri Mar 08, 2013 5:59 am

OneWithTheAssassins wrote:
noobcannon wrote:why didn't i get any cool IT foreshadowing in my tali romance scene? all i got was her was singing that stupid song. sounded like a cat going through the washing machine.

You aren't using that meme picture properly. Just saying.

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by noobcannon on Fri Mar 08, 2013 6:00 am

SwobyJ wrote:
noobcannon wrote:why didn't i get any cool IT foreshadowing in my tali romance scene? all i got was her was singing that stupid song. sounded like a cat going through the washing machine.

Just a crap mention of 'dawn' in the song.

Otherwise yeah, just screeching :P

at first she says "we can sing along" and then i was all like...


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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by spotlessvoid on Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:18 am

The Batarian clerk at the arcade door says to pick a prize out of our newly restored claw game. The one supposedly foreshadowing destroy as best.

Elcor Actor has some curious Hamlet quoting too
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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Raistlin Majere on Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:41 am

Liara has some nice ones as well if romanced.

First in the apartment Shepard basically promises that he will come back alive. I don't remember the exact words, but I recall him basically saying that he will make sure every day after the war is like then.

And then after the party when everyone is heading back to the Normandy Liara promises that she will be with Shepard until the end, no matter what happens.

And yet we are still suppose to believe she chickened out with Joker and the rest of the crew?

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by spotlessvoid on Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:59 am

One could argue the vorchs hustler is foreshadowing that all 3 choices equal fail and only refusing to play is victory
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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by MaximizedAction on Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:11 am

Raistlin Majere wrote:Liara has some nice ones as well if romanced.

First in the apartment Shepard basically promises that he will come back alive. I don't remember the exact words, but I recall him basically saying that he will make sure every day after the war is like then.

And then after the party when everyone is heading back to the Normandy Liara promises that she will be with Shepard until the end, no matter what happens.

And yet we are still suppose to believe she chickened out with Joker and the rest of the crew?

Yeah...what are we to believe?

The only way them saving their asses makes sense, if Hackett had convinced them that it was important to keep as many ships operational as possible, in case the Crucible hadn't worked and they'd have to fight the Reapers. But he seemed rather sure of what it does, which is odd considering the premise was that no one knew.

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Jarrod_L on Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:17 am

DoomsdayDevice wrote:So I kept myself away from the internet for three days, because I was going to play the DLC and wanted to stay spoiler free. I knew I was going to have little time to play, and that it was probably going to take me three days to finish it. And it did. I haven't even done everything in there, anyway...

First off (and y'all are probably going to hate me for this, but screw you), I loved this DLC for what it was. The clone storyline didn't make a whole lot of sense, but it was pretty cool anyway. The social part, as little sense as it made within the given timeline, was absolutely fantastic. I watched Thane's memorial through my tears, I laughed my arse off at drunk Grunt in the shower, etcetera. So many memorable moments. But let me get to the point...

What confused the HELL out of me, was the CRAZY amount of MAJOR ending foreshadowing in this DLC.

From the first moment you enter the apartment, EVERY SINGLE ONE of Anderson's datapads is giving you clue after clue after clue. Everything is foreshadowed! Even the ending choice is explained!

In the ANN interview, Anderson explains exactly that a good leader always tries to save everyone, but there will be a moment where you can't. And that when you're not prepared to sacrifice people, the price you will end up paying might well be a lot higher.

He even talks about how some leaders, no matter how good they always were, will end up making the wrong decision in their defining moment. Oh, and "THE GALAXY TENDS TO MAKE EXAMPLES OF THEM". Shocked

He talks about how many people are concerned about Shepard coming back alive, FFS!

All that stuff about how your instincts can save you when you don't know what to do....

And then when he says something along the lines of "Sometimes all people need, is to get a pat on the back and be told that they did good, and that everything is going to be all right." I mean, COME ON!

I can go on and on. EVERY SINGLE one of those recordings was foreshadowing the ending!!!

The biggest jawdropper was when Zaeed and Samara were discussing that painting, and Zaeed described what it made him think of... and word for word it reminded me of the breath scene... I had tears in my eyes, goosebumps all over, I looked at that painting and realized it looked like what Shepard would see, waking up in the rubble.

Zaeed: "It makes me feel uneasy, like when you're alone in the dark, lying in wait, and a cold wind brushes across your face, like the kiss of death."

And at that moment I just KNEW I was going to get to see Shepard get out of that rubble. I just KNEW.

EDIT: Check out this Jack quote from the romance content:

Jack: Good enough so that if you're ever hurt, barely breathing, lying under a pile of rubble at the ass end of this war, you're gonna have...

WINNING

However, as I finished the DLC I started having doubts, there was just so much content in there, that I couldn't imagine there would be more post-ending.

Sure enough, I played on through Cronos and Priority: Earth today, did the ending again, hoping for maybe a ten second clip or something at the end, but wasn't really surprised to see there wasn't anything.

So I'm just terribly confused right now.

Bioware, if you're not planning on going anywhere with the ending, then WHY FOR FUCK'S SAKE DO YOU KEEP GIVING ME HOPE WITH ALL THIS GOD DAMN FORESHADOWING!!!!!

I don't get it.

Is it just me? Did anyone else have a similar experience?

It's not just you. :)

This DLC is filled with references to making "the right choice" and not giving up hope.

A couple of notable quotes you did not bring up:
Anderson (one of the audio logs): "In the end, you just have to hope you made the right choices."
Anderson (another log): "Sometimes, that's all it takes. A joke. A pat on the back. A little reminder that everything's gonna be okay."
The final scene of the DLC, just before returning to the Normandy: this scene is different for every LI, but in every version I've seen Shepard's soulmate tells him/her it's going to be ok, and that Shepard is going to find a way to make it right.

I'm just going to trust Bioware, relax, sit back and wait patiently for ME4 now. I think they know what they're doing.

P.S. Still would have liked to also get another significant IT hint - like one more nightmare, perhaps.

P.P.S. Oh, and you can play this DLC after going through the ending! Ignore it until the end, pick Destroy, watch the cutscenes, the Stargazer scene. Then you'll be back on the Normandy, right before assaulting Cerberus HQ. Head to the Citadel and celebrate! Sure, some of the dialog will be off - but the mood is right, and that's what matters.


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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Raistlin Majere on Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:24 am

MaximizedAction wrote:
Raistlin Majere wrote:Liara has some nice ones as well if romanced.

First in the apartment Shepard basically promises that he will come back alive. I don't remember the exact words, but I recall him basically saying that he will make sure every day after the war is like then.

And then after the party when everyone is heading back to the Normandy Liara promises that she will be with Shepard until the end, no matter what happens.

And yet we are still suppose to believe she chickened out with Joker and the rest of the crew?

Yeah...what are we to believe?

The only way them saving their asses makes sense, if Hackett had convinced them that it was important to keep as many ships operational as possible, in case the Crucible hadn't worked and they'd have to fight the Reapers. But he seemed rather sure of what it does, which is odd considering the premise was that no one knew.

Even if Hacket wanted to keep ships operational Joker and EDI can handle that on their own. The rest of the crew can, and should considering the situation, fight on the ground alongside Shepard. I have said this before but it bears repeating.

We went through a suicide mission with some of the squad members and Shepard while aware of the suicidal nature of the mission and indeed expecting that not all would make it out alive, never flinched on the fact that it needed to be done and neither did the crew. But here on the beam run a critical part of a mission of infinitely more importance he wants his crew to evacuate and the crew agrees.

It is mind boggling stupid.

Though on another note am I the only one who thought Javik was hilarious in this DLC? His lines and the scenes he ends up in are hilarious. True that can be said for most the crew, but Javik stuck out to me.


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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by spotlessvoid on Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:41 am

Me4? Not waiting lol. In the meantime 1-3 remains unplayable for entire sections of their fan base. Thanks for buying all our DLC now trust us it will all be worth it years later
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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by MaximizedAction on Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:54 am

So how about this:

Brooks not helping CloneShep up is a foreshadowing of the EC scene where the Normandy chickens out when the Crucible is loading:

Brooks represents one of the squadmember aboard the Normandy/Normandy itself when they flee and CloneShep is the Shep left on the Crucible. This would mean that he former are not who they appeared to be prior to the scene; and the latter, while looking like Shep from the outside, isn't really him anymore on the inside/personality = indoc'd.

Because otherwise, the moral of the story with Brooks not helping up CloneShep is just truly cheesy on accident, unlike the rest of the DLC.

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Restrider on Fri Mar 08, 2013 10:13 am

DoomsdayDevice wrote:So I kept myself away from the internet for three days, because I was going to play the DLC and wanted to stay spoiler free. I knew I was going to have little time to play, and that it was probably going to take me three days to finish it. And it did. I haven't even done everything in there, anyway...

First off (and y'all are probably going to hate me for this, but screw you), I loved this DLC for what it was. The clone storyline didn't make a whole lot of sense, but it was pretty cool anyway. The social part, as little sense as it made within the given timeline, was absolutely fantastic. I watched Thane's memorial through my tears, I laughed my arse off at drunk Grunt in the shower, etcetera. So many memorable moments. But let me get to the point...

What confused the HELL out of me, was the CRAZY amount of MAJOR ending foreshadowing in this DLC.

From the first moment you enter the apartment, EVERY SINGLE ONE of Anderson's datapads is giving you clue after clue after clue. Everything is foreshadowed! Even the ending choice is explained!

In the ANN interview, Anderson explains exactly that a good leader always tries to save everyone, but there will be a moment where you can't. And that when you're not prepared to sacrifice people, the price you will end up paying might well be a lot higher.

He even talks about how some leaders, no matter how good they always were, will end up making the wrong decision in their defining moment. Oh, and "THE GALAXY TENDS TO MAKE EXAMPLES OF THEM". Shocked

He talks about how many people are concerned about Shepard coming back alive, FFS!

All that stuff about how your instincts can save you when you don't know what to do....

And then when he says something along the lines of "Sometimes all people need, is to get a pat on the back and be told that they did good, and that everything is going to be all right." I mean, COME ON!

I can go on and on. EVERY SINGLE one of those recordings was foreshadowing the ending!!!

The biggest jawdropper was when Zaeed and Samara were discussing that painting, and Zaeed described what it made him think of... and word for word it reminded me of the breath scene... I had tears in my eyes, goosebumps all over, I looked at that painting and realized it looked like what Shepard would see, waking up in the rubble.

Zaeed: "It makes me feel uneasy, like when you're alone in the dark, lying in wait, and a cold wind brushes across your face, like the kiss of death."

And at that moment I just KNEW I was going to get to see Shepard get out of that rubble. I just KNEW.

EDIT: Check out this Jack quote from the romance content:

Jack: Good enough so that if you're ever hurt, barely breathing, lying under a pile of rubble at the ass end of this war, you're gonna have...

WINNING

However, as I finished the DLC I started having doubts, there was just so much content in there, that I couldn't imagine there would be more post-ending.

Sure enough, I played on through Cronos and Priority: Earth today, did the ending again, hoping for maybe a ten second clip or something at the end, but wasn't really surprised to see there wasn't anything.

So I'm just terribly confused right now.

Bioware, if you're not planning on going anywhere with the ending, then WHY FOR FUCK'S SAKE DO YOU KEEP GIVING ME HOPE WITH ALL THIS GOD DAMN FORESHADOWING!!!!!

I don't get it.

Is it just me? Did anyone else have a similar experience?

Welcome in the paradise of cognitive dissonance!

What you described is exactly how I felt after the DLC.

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Restrider on Fri Mar 08, 2013 10:22 am

Pascal219 wrote:I still don't get why people here were so disappointed with this DLC. Besides that it is awesome (despite out of place), it's oozing with foreshadowing. Anyone and all doubts were erased when hearing Anderson's datapad recordings.

This maybe too optimistic, but I think the next DLC is going to drop soon. The current multiplayer operation feels like a last push, it's described that way too. And don't get me started on the meanings of ''Lodestar''. ;)
Agreed. Also bear in mind that this DLC that supposedly does not touch the endings induced some bugs... at the endings.
As far as I know this includes blackscreens during the slideshow and a green explosion if you choose Destroy (although the latter is just hearsay). Regardless, bugs are there, but how if the endings are not touched??

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by FFZero on Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:57 am

I wish I had the same optimism as all of you but I’ve just come to the conclusion that BW are the cruelest game dev’s in the world. They add things like this because they love screwing with their fanbase, wanting to keep us invested in the series as long as possible and keep hoping for more while we all know deep inside that it’s never going to come.
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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by MaximizedAction on Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:02 pm

FFZero wrote:I wish I had the same optimism as all of you but I’ve just come to the conclusion that BW are the cruelest game dev’s in the world. They add things like this because they love screwing with their fanbase, wanting to keep us invested in the series as long as possible and keep hoping for more while we all know deep inside that it’s never going to come.

I'm SO looking forward to ME's stage at PAX East. Just want to hear Casey arguing for the ending and what their motivation and hopes - because he said once shortly pre-release of ME3 that they only feel good about doing something if it they're sure that the players will like it.

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by FFZero on Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:05 pm

MaximizedAction wrote:
FFZero wrote:I wish I had the same optimism as all of you but I’ve just come to the conclusion that BW are the cruelest game dev’s in the world. They add things like this because they love screwing with their fanbase, wanting to keep us invested in the series as long as possible and keep hoping for more while we all know deep inside that it’s never going to come.

I'm SO looking forward to ME's stage at PAX East. Just want to hear Casey arguing for the ending and what their motivation and hopes.

It will be interesting. I just hope we get some sodding answers and they're not all cop-outs where they basically say 'Oh yeah, we wanted to leave that up to the player to decide'

I'm just fucking done with their BS. I’m mostly past the depression stage and now there’s just this feeling of disappointment and anger left over. Regardless of an IT confirmation ME3 had so much potential and it was all wasted because some of the devs are on an ego trip.
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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by MaximizedAction on Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:16 pm

FFZero wrote:

It will be interesting. I just hope we get some sodding answers and they're not all cop-outs where they basically say 'Oh yeah, we wanted to leave that up to the player to decide'

I'm just fucking done with their BS. I’m mostly past the depression stage and now there’s just this feeling of disappointment and anger left over. Regardless of an IT confirmation ME3 had so much potential and it was all wasted because some of the devs are on an ego trip.

Considering how Casey said that they only like something they've created when they can be sure that players will like it...open endings/open to interpretation are usually not a safe bet for larger audiences.

On the other hand...if you don't look too closely into the details, the 'literal' ending kindof does provide an end.

On the third hand, thinking back to those numerious youtube videos published, of the players' reactions...they weren't really a sign that people liked it either.

What in the name of the flying spaghetti monster isn't letting them release a proper ending that most people will like? It's not like they forgot how to appeal to players *cough* Citadel *cough*.


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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by dorktainian on Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:17 pm

Pax will be full of fucking happy clappers again. Why wait for Casey when you know he's gonna just spout more utter bollocks?

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by MaximizedAction on Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:18 pm

dork wrote:Pax will be full of fucking happy clappers again. Why wait for Casey when you know he's gonna just spout more utter bollocks?

Because there's nothing else left to do...

...except for beating all of Aria's scores, that is. Grin

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Andromidius on Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:26 pm

Yet more proof that the average gamer is an easy to please pleb who forgets everything the moment something shiny is dangled in front of their faces.

Appealing to the mass audience gets lots of money, but its not condusive to breaking ground or creating true art.

I think I figured out why I dislike the DLC's action side - it feels like an Expendables movie. And while I love the Expendables, I'd be a bit miffed if Star Trek tried to tap into that market and mindset.
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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by BleedingUranium on Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:29 pm

PAX will be interesting. Either they'll have just released a reveal, or they'll... what? I mean, what could they talk about with the perception of the game what it is? It will either go really well for them, or very poorly.


Also, I love that Barla Von is the all time top scorer in the Arena, and some of the people even talk about it Rofl
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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Restrider on Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:30 pm

dork wrote:Pax will be full of fucking happy clappers again. Why wait for Casey when you know he's gonna just spout more utter bollocks?
Yeah, probably more of what happened after EC with a part of the fandom. Mindlessly cheering for a product which is only at first glance addressing the main problems of the game.
And since for most people the endings debate was over in the summer of 2012, I doubt that they are going to talk about it very much, if they are even asked about it in the first place.
I guess the most interesting questions might be what ME4 could have in store.

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by MaximizedAction on Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:33 pm

Restrider wrote:
dork wrote:Pax will be full of fucking happy clappers again. Why wait for Casey when you know he's gonna just spout more utter bollocks?
Yeah, probably more of what happened after EC with a part of the fandom. Mindlessly cheering for a product which is only at first glance addressing the main problems of the game.
And since for most people the endings debate was over in the summer of 2012, I doubt that they are going to talk about it very much, if they are even asked about it in the first place.
I guess the most interesting questions might be what ME4 could have in store.

The premise of the PAX event is: main topic is the trilogy.

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Re: I am SO confused about all of this... (Major ending foreshadowing in Citadel DLC)

Post by Rifneno on Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:46 pm

BleedingUranium wrote:PAX will be interesting. Either they'll have just released a reveal, or they'll... what? I mean, what could they talk about with the perception of the game what it is? It will either go really well for them, or very poorly.


Also, I love that Barla Von is the all time top scorer in the Arena, and some of the people even talk about it Rofl

Hahahahahahaha. And the wheel has reached turn. Charter members of IT will remember high hopes for last year's PAX too. Guess what happened? Nothing. Here, I'll let you know what's going to happen at PAX. Some approved questions like "Will Mass Effect 4 be exciting?" with answers like "Yes!" or maybe "Will it be a shooter with RPG elements?" and "Maybe!" After a few minutes, you'll be told to buy DLC and they'll thank everyone for the love and leave.

PAX. Interesting. Oh that's rich. LOL.

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