Re: (XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV!

by noobcannon Fri Jun 19, 2015 6:22 pm

DoomsdayDevice wrote:
smash016 wrote:Some scenario that will put Shepard's adventure in a different perspective.

This is probably the "best" we can hope for, but I'm not counting on it.

maybe some tyler durden / ed norton fight club shit? they did say they tried/wanted to simulate indoctrination through gameplay in me3 but couldn't get it to feel right.

by Eryri Fri Jun 19, 2015 6:22 pm

Re those tweets...

Ah Bioware. Once again you're somehow managing to snatch mediocrity from the jaws of greatness. Bra-fucking-vo. Angry

However, since I am, apparently, a glutton for punishment...

ElSuperGecko wrote:

...not Shepard, but something inhabiting the body of Shepard - wouldn't something like that be a "reveal" in and of itself? No further explanations necessary.

Assuming direct control? Could be... Just so long as he doesn't start leaping around like a frog and sticking to the ceiling.

The N7 in the Andromeda trailer - flicking through the screens of various planets - looks like he's searching for something. A habitable planet to colonize? Ancient technology? Native life? Hunting synthetics, a la the Shepalyst in the Mass Shift crap?

That cocky way he draws his gun makes him look more like a robber or a thug. It would be nice if we could get a good look at whoever he's fighting.

DoomsdayDevice wrote:I don't think anyone here honestly believes there will be a reveal, Rif.

We just can't help ourselves speculating, though we probably won't get anything we'd like to see.

Indeed. I think I get more of a kick out of all our crazy theories than I did from playing the games. So, I'll continue to speculate and enjoy the awesome version of ME4 that I have in my head... Up until the day Bioware ruins it by releasing whatever disappointing thing they have actually made.

by noobcannon Fri Jun 19, 2015 6:24 pm

this is an old post i started but since we are speculating if the n7 soldier could be an existing character or not, here's a list of every character that survives through the end of me3 no matter what.

noobcannon wrote:wanted to have a list of everyone in the series who survives to the end no matter what. joker, hackett, and coates are the only three i can think of. not sure about traynor.

EDIT: here's everyone so far.

Aria
Joker
Hackett
Traynor
Bailey
Coates
khalisah Al Jilani
Lieutenant Gregory Adams
Primarch Adrien Victus
Dalatrass Linron
Dianna Allers
Glyph
Dr. Chloe Michel
Harrot
Sarah Campbell
Bethany Westmoreland
Shaman
Ish

*Councilor Irissa (replaces Tevos if council dies in ME1)
*Councilor Quentius (replaces Sparatus if council dies in ME1)

unless they are playing with semantics or straight up lying about it not being shepard, looks like it would have to be a completely new character imo.

by **DoomsdayDevice** Fri Jun 19, 2015 6:43 pm

Well, if it -was- Shepard, you could be sure they wouldn't tell us.

But that doesn't mean it is. :|

by Raistlin Majere Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:19 pm

noobcannon wrote:
DoomsdayDevice wrote:
smash016 wrote:Some scenario that will put Shepard's adventure in a different perspective.

This is probably the "best" we can hope for, but I'm not counting on it.

maybe some tyler durden / ed norton fight club shit? they did say they tried/wanted to simulate indoctrination through gameplay in me3 but couldn't get it to feel right.

Funny then that they got it too feel exactly right considering all the symptoms Shepard goes through and the weird shit that is happening at the end...

Sigh...

FFS Bioware all that potential just fucking wasted.

by **DoomsdayDevice** Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:25 pm

You know, writers (both for games and for books) are generally known to sabotage fan theories. Just to stay unpredictable. So it could be we just figured it out prematurely, and the rest is history. Maybe one day we'll know for sure.

by ElSuperGecko Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:43 pm

noobcannon wrote:look its shepard!

The Catalyst (having assumed control of Shepard's body) on Murmur it is then! CONFIRMED.

DoomsdayDevice wrote:You know, writers (both for games and for books) are generally known to sabotage fan theories. Just to stay unpredictable. So it could be we just figured it out prematurely, and the rest is history. Maybe one day we'll know for sure.

So what you're saying is, we may never be proven right, but we'll technically never ever be wrong! Mua-hah. Haha. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

PissChriestly wrote:It's official. You're wrong.

Sod off you fat fuck.

by smash016 Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:52 pm

What really gets to me is the possibility that whoever might have figured it all out, won't be vindicated because of all that's happened since ME3's release.

That they just ditched a potentially awesome story, because of publisher and fan pressure, and changing personnel and what not, and that sooner or later some guy, like Casey Hudson, in some obscure magazine, will tell us they had wholly different plans originally, teases us about it, then shuts up about it. And then that's that.

by Eryri Fri Jun 19, 2015 8:22 pm

noobcannon wrote:look its shepard!

IKR!?

The fuck are they playing at? They must have known that people would immediately think "Shepard's back! Yes!" on seeing that trailer. Yet they decide to almost immediately shoot down those hopes on Twitter?

If Rif was right about them trying to lure us in to buying the game in the vain hope of seeing Shepard and the Reapers, why disappoint us so soon? Do they think that merely having someone who looks vaguely Shepardish is going to fill us with enough warm, fuzzy associations to make us part with our hard-earned cash? If so, they are in for a rude awakening. It would be like going to a bar and ordering a glass of vintage champagne, only for the barman to say "Sorry sir, we're out of Bolinger. But I've peed in a bottle and run it through a Soda Stream. It looks almost exactly the same!"

Sorry, I felt like venting. Rant over.

by dorktainian Fri Jun 19, 2015 8:39 pm

Shep on a reaper, hunting down synthetics, playing a little johnny cash, being so damn bad.

Anyways, we're all speculating at the moment, and we know jack shit. All the Bioware fan boys will be wank frapping over this teaser trailer, but I'm a bit meh. It showed nothing. Absolutely nothing. There was no context in the vid.

What a load of fucking bullshit. We wait all this time for THIS? What the fuck? Also, the gfx in the trailer. There is NO WAY they are going to be able to reproduce that 'in game'. Consoles are a long time away from being able to produce something that not even a top of the line PC could produce yet. If they are running this game in pre-alpha (way way pre alpha) at Bioware it will be about the same quality as DAI (if they're lucky) ..... and that was ok, but not great at all compared to some other games. Hell even The Last of Us on the PS4 pisses all over DAI graffically an thats a remaster.

I'm more looking forward to a FF7 remake than MEA at the moment.

Also, if it were so long after ME3, why was the N7 carrying the same pistol as sheploo? surely technology would've moooooved things along.

by smash016 Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:02 pm

Still haven't told us jack shit about the story, no. Just aesthetics every fucking time we get to see a tidbit.

*Sliver of hope*

by symbowles Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:38 pm

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 YxVOpe

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 KrVnOp

There's literally a million other ways they could have done this. They can't resist to troll, they just can't. From ambiguous tweets and interviews, to lies, to RBG pics, to this. Bioware will not miss a chance to fuck with us.

by **DoomsdayDevice** Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:57 pm

The "new" N7 turns the other way. That's about the only difference. Shepard turns left, the "other" turns right.

by Eryri Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:59 pm

So, we're back to it being one of the following:

James Vega - likeable but nowhere near enough charisma or popularity to warrant a high profile spot in a teaser.

Some brand new random N7 - who shall forever be thought of as "Mr Not-Shepard" - completely pointless.

Shepard's clone - who we didn't actually see die, and at least has some history in the series. Why the fuck he would be in Andromeda I don't know. Maybe he sold his soul to the Reapers for another chance at revenge?

Edit - or, (a very outside chance), it's Shepard's body used as a meat puppet by a Reaper. Bioware's semantic games again.

by **DoomsdayDevice** Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:04 pm

Look, if it's true what they're saying, and this is far in the future, then the chances of it being someone we know are slim to none, unless, you know, it's a re-built Shepard or something.

by Eryri Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:11 pm

DoomsdayDevice wrote:Look, if it's true what they're saying, and this is far in the future, then the chances of it being someone we know are slim to none, unless, you know, it's a re-built Shepard or something.

Which would just be retreading the Lazarus Project again. Yeah, you're probably right.

Meh, time to find a new video game obsession. The new Deus Ex look good, and the FF7 remake is coming. And at least Square Enix isn't quite so in love with the smell of its own farts.

by **DoomsdayDevice** Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:13 pm

Seriously can't wait for Fallout 4. Awesome crafting and weapons customization system, building settlements, HELLS to the YEAH.

by Guest Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:51 pm

Spoiler:

EDIT: No theories about this. Its just kinda cool.

by demersel Fri Jun 19, 2015 11:22 pm

I just want to say, conserning the Mass Shift stuff - let's say Shepard's body is a meat puppet controlled by a reaper or a reaper like entity, with the real Shepard identity being either purged, subdued, or absorbed (or locked into some far corner of the mind in a mental prison complete with casinos, arcade arena, furniture shop, a combat sim and an option to do the assault on Cerberus HQ and Priority Earth over and over again) - and maybe even that reaper entiity is created by the crucible choice... so Catalyst would really be a sound name for such an entity. Granted, it does not rpoduce such immedeate authority and menace as, say, Sovereign (AKA Nazara) or Harbinger... but still it kinda fits the pattern of giving the reapers designations based on their indended function.

in the mass shift stuff the names mentioned are Catalyst, Advent and Murmur (Murmur being my personal favourite) - but i doubt that stuff was legit, or stayed unchanged.

In the more recent and apperantly more legit andromeda survey leak we get the name of the ship - Tempest.

Tempest is a really curious and cool name to pick, cause it suggests a lot.

Tempest suggests betreyal, a coop, exile, new and foreign lands, new assumed identity, aquired power, plotting revenge, coming to terms, forgiveness and redemption.

In the trilogy they joked about Hamlet, making a clear nod at Shepard symbolicly being Hamlet - a person put in circumstances who needs to decide how to act on them, if at all, with a looming inevitable tragic end.

In the Citadel DLC they joked about the next story being more of a Macbeth - a story of a war heor and decorated soldier getting consumed by ambition, actting upon it, gaining powerr and becoming a ruthless tyrant, a villian... with the tragedy being the invebility of it... Whether or not they meant that as the future for Shepard or actually the tone and idea of the next game , who knows.

Point is - they are consistent with their Shakespearean references. And those references are great for IT, since they kind of sort of imply the connection to Shepard, who is a known poetry expert. )

by ZerebusPrime Sat Jun 20, 2015 3:24 am

SwobyJ wrote:

EDIT: No theories about this. Its just kinda cool.

Very nice.

by noobcannon Sat Jun 20, 2015 3:30 am

DoomsdayDevice wrote:Look, if it's true what they're saying, and this is far in the future, then the chances of it being someone we know are slim to none, unless, you know, it's a re-built Shepard or something.

THE CRUCIBLE IS A TIME MACHINE!!!!!!!!

by Eryri Sat Jun 20, 2015 4:21 am

DoomsdayDevice wrote:Seriously can't wait for Fallout 4. Awesome crafting and weapons customization system, building settlements, HELLS to the YEAH.

It does make want to jump into this franchise, I'll admit. Especially as it's now got a fully voice acted protagonist - played, if I'm not mistaken, by Troy Baker who is excellent in everything he does. Well, apart from that one role...

demersel wrote:I just want to say, conserning the Mass Shift stuff - let's say Shepard's body is a meat puppet controlled by a reaper or a reaper like entity, with the real Shepard identity being either purged, subdued, or absorbed (or locked into some far corner of the mind in a mental prison complete with casinos, arcade arena, furniture shop, a combat sim and an option to do the assault on Cerberus HQ and Priority Earth over and over again)

Hi Demersel.

Rifneno will probably give a verbal bollocking for saying this (and perhaps rightly so), but that is actually a weirdly elegant explanation for Citadel's excessive fan-wankery.

noobcannon wrote:

THE CRUCIBLE IS A TIME MACHINE!!!!!!!!

Heh, heh. Well, time travel is the one sci-fi cliche they haven't used yet.

Sigh... OK I'll admit it. Crazy but beautiful fan theories are my version of crack.

by noobcannon Sat Jun 20, 2015 4:46 am

Eryri wrote:
Sigh... OK I'll admit it. Crazy but beautiful fan theories are my version of crack.

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 Dfx9V14

by DaniSaur Sat Jun 20, 2015 4:57 am

You guys have basically said everything I'm thinking, and much more eloquently than I could have to boot, so I'll just show you some things I found in the trailer. It might be nothing, but I figured I'd let you guys be the judge.

I found this between the vids of the planets that Not-Shepard is scanning:
(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 PQpfvdI

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 PQpfvdI

It says "Ark" on the side of the slide if you're wondering what the heck I'm showing you.

Also, you can kinda see the ship/Reaper/whatever that Not-Shepard is on in the reflection of this one:
(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 JbsKDqB

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 JbsKDqB

Anyway, just thought I'd share. I have to say, I've missed those days when you guys came up with new ideas pretty much every day, so it's nice to see it sort of happening again.

Eryri wrote:It does make want to jump into this franchise, I'll admit. Especially as it's now got a fully voice acted protagonist - played, if I'm not mistaken, by Troy Baker who is excellent in everything he does. Well, apart from that one role...

I think there was a tweet that said he was voiced by Brian T. Delaney (who voiced Roland in Halo 4), but I can't seem to find it. Also, the female protagonist is voiced by Courtenay Taylor, so that is quite awesome as well.

by Rifneno Sat Jun 20, 2015 10:41 am

DoomsdayDevice wrote:I don't think anyone here honestly believes there will be a reveal, Rif.

We just can't help ourselves speculating, though we probably won't get anything we'd like to see.

Never underestimate the naivity of people.

smash016 wrote:
Rifneno wrote:I can't believe you guys honestly think that there's going to be a reveal after they've completely wiped their asses with the lore to put the game in an entirely new galaxy with the only possible reason being to avoid handling the endings.

You couldn't believe the game would honestly be set in a new galaxy either, but it is.

See what I mean, DD?

I didn't believe the game could be set in a new galaxy because I thought the game might actually make sense, or that they'd abandon the incredible cliffhanger they left. But they did. They abandon the entire fucking galaxy to do so. And you're still hoping. You want to have your cake and eat it too. You're not going to get to.

I was telling everyone not to worry because X is just missing for a day and we don't know anything bad happened. Now, the police have called. X is in the morgue and they need someone to identify the body. And you're saying it's just some random hobo who looks exactly like them and has their ID.

Raistlin Majere wrote:Funny then that they got it too feel exactly right considering all the symptoms Shepard goes through and the weird shit that is happening at the end...

Sigh...

FFS Bioware all that potential just fucking wasted.

Amen. :(

DoomsdayDevice wrote:You know, writers (both for games and for books) are generally known to sabotage fan theories. Just to stay unpredictable. So it could be we just figured it out prematurely, and the rest is history. Maybe one day we'll know for sure.

No.

Bioware is not known for that. Furthermore, we didn't figure out anything that wasn't bloody obvious.

dorktainian wrote:I'm more looking forward to a FF7 remake than MEA at the moment.

I wouldn't get too excited. SE quickly doused our hopes. They... actually, I'll just paste chat, it's better anyway.

[08:00:45] Rifneno : lawl. "Final Fantasy 7 Remake’s Story Could Deviate from the Original"
[08:00:47] Rifneno : And so it begins...
[08:02:20] @ Norlond : meanwhile in the sqenix offices: "and when seph is about to kill aerith, lightning comes in and saves the day, gamers everywhere will love her for saving her!"
[08:02:48] Rifneno : I was just hoping that Tifa would die instead of Aeris, but your version is totally on the money I think
[08:04:26] @ Norlond : i think so too and i hate the universe for being the way it is because of that
[08:04:42] RavenEyry : Plus Cloud has a smartphone that connects to the players facebook
[08:05:17] Rifneno : He had a smartphone in Advent Children, so...
[08:05:21] Rifneno : Probably, yes.
[08:07:47] RavenEyry : Barrett's personality changed completely to be more racially sensitive
[08:08:29] umadcommander joined the chat on Fri Jun 19, 2015 8:08 am
[08:08:35] @ Norlond : ey commander
[08:08:38] Rifneno : I hope it goes the other way, and he starts calling Cloud "Mah nigga!" and shit
[08:08:46] umadcommander : heyo
[08:08:53] umadcommander : site wouldnt load for a while
[08:11:19] Rifneno : That would be magnificent, actually. Cloud and Tifa get into an argument and Barret tries to cheer Cloud up with an inspirational "Bitches be trippin' yo"
[08:11:38] @ Norlond : lol
[08:11:42] Rifneno : I would buy a PS4 just for FF7 with super racist Barret

I do worry that Nor was dangerously close to the truth. A cameo by Lightning is almost assured as long as that one exec with a love doll of her still has say so.

symbowles wrote:There's literally a million other ways they could have done this. They can't resist to troll, they just can't. From ambiguous tweets and interviews, to lies, to RBG pics, to this. Bioware will not miss a chance to fuck with us.

That's the relationship between Bioware and intelligent Mass Effect fans.

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 20070409

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 20070409

Eryri wrote:So, we're back to it being one of the following:

James Vega - likeable but nowhere near enough charisma or popularity to warrant a high profile spot in a teaser.

Vega's the size of a bear, he wouldn't fit in that suit. Whoever's in there is the size of a normal human being, not Zangief from Street Fighter.

DoomsdayDevice wrote:Look, if it's true what they're saying, and this is far in the future, then the chances of it being someone we know are slim to none, unless, you know, it's a re-built Shepard or something.

I was going to say "far in the future" probably just means that it would take hundreds and hundreds of years to even get to Andromeda, but then I remembered they've abandoned all existing lore.

Eryri wrote:and the FF7 remake is coming. And at least Square Enix isn't quite so in love with the smell of its own farts.

No, they're in love with the smell of Lightning's farts.

I just got into Dissidia again. It's a perfect example of how Square looks at things nowadays. In the original game, the main heroes of 1-10 all work together to save the world. There's some cheesy shit where Firion is dreaming of flowers and Cloud needs his ritalin but you get the idea.

... Then comes the sequel? You thought that they were the heroes? Lawls, no. It was all LIGHTNING! Everyone was fucked by manikins, but LIGHTNING stopped them. Sure, a few other idiots tagged along, but really it was Lightning. Laguna couldn't save fucking baseball cards, and Vaan was too busy showing everyone his armpits to do it. Lightning was CLEARLY the leader who wrangled a few idiots to be meatshields and stop the manikin horde. But then everyone forgot that the REAL hero of everything is Lightning because Dissidia thinks amnesia is just the best plot device since time travel. The most poignant example is the cover art.

Original game:

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 Dissidia%20Box%20Art_(Cosmos)

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 Dissidia%20Box%20Art_(Cosmos)

Everyone is represented as a group. Equally. No one is in a sort of "main" position.

Duodecim, now with infinitely more LIGHTNING:

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 Dissidia-012-final-fantasy-walkthrough-box-small

(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV! - Page 3 Dissidia-012-final-fantasy-walkthrough-box-small

Everyone equ--LIGHTNING, FRONT AND CENTER MOTHERFUCKER. There's some noobs in the back too. But look! LIGHTNING!

The 13th cycle, where the war is finally ended, which Lightning isn't even a part of, has been renamed "Light For All." Un-fucking-believable.

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