Re: GameTrailers.com Delivers "The Final Verdict" On ME3 Ending

by Raistlin Majere Tue Jul 30, 2013 10:55 pm

magnetite wrote:When people make movies and such, they tend to write the script first, then make the movie. Mass Effect 3 wouldn't be any different. According to the leaked script last year, nothing really happens after you pick the final choice. No epilogue or anything. I mean TIM scene was changed, but everything else was the same.

That does not make it right, or better or good storytelling in any way.

To give an example from my own stories. I have two characters who went of to stop a threat, they knew they would most likely die, but promised to come back alive if possible.

They end up surviving, but only barely and despite everything being done to save them they die after saying their farewell to their family.

The reason I let them survive and then die in this case is because it was important to show that they did everything in their power to survive. They did not succeed in that part, but at least they could say goodbye.

Now imagine if I let what happened to the threat they fought be ambiguous and simply told the people reading that the two of them were barely breathing...what would that say about the story? About the end?

Now i do not claim to be a master of storytelling in anyway and i do not need everything explained, but when the ending of the main characters story is supposedly him being near death in a pile of rubble with possibly a giant killer robot right above him and his crew somewhere not even remotely logical and yet still somehow know he is alive...I do not rate that as good storytelling, much less what i would ever define as an ending for a story.

Seriously it is as bad, if not worse than the Teen Titan cartoon last episode which felt more like the start of a new season rather than the ending it supposedly was.

Also Magnetite unless I sat with the actual script in my hand I would not try to even guess at what is in it or what the intentions were, simple as that.

by Rifneno Tue Jul 30, 2013 11:33 pm

magnetite wrote:Mass Effect 3 will end Shepard's story, not Reapers

Bullshit. It does not say that.

I don't know what else to say. We paid $60 to have them write us a story. What are people going to do, hold Bioware hostage until they get what they want?

Yeah, speaking their minds on the Internet and not buying further products is just like a hostage situation. That's not idiotic even by strawman standards.

Thing is, Mass Effect 3 ended development back in March 2013. In the world of software development, Mass Effect 3 has reached it's end of life for the game. No new update, patches or content. They're done with this game.

Oh hey there, Captain Obvious. When did you get here?

People are fine to disagree on how they ended it, but to demand proper closure or have closure how we see fit. It's not our story to tell.

Bullshit. They made claims about a product that turned out to be blatant lies. It's damn well within the consumer's right to demand what was promised to them.

I mean look, it's all about family dynamics:

-One guy likes the original endings
-One guy likes the extended cut
-One guy wants the entire ending rewritten
-One guy wants the entire game redone
-One guy wants to see X scene specifically for his Shepard (Tali house or whatever)

Change any one of those and someone will not be satisfied.

So because you can't please everyone, don't even try to please anyone and don't even try to deliver on the claims you made to sell the product. Fanboy logic is as bad as Sevial logic.

Even if it was "our story" like the claimed, who's the one who has to make and test all the content? Bioware.

Sorry, I'm a bit off my nut. I need to go lie down.

Well we're agreed on that last part. I'm still waiting on an explanation for how Gamble's "Breath scene is on the Citadel" tweet isn't a lie BTW.

by CSSteele Tue Jul 30, 2013 11:54 pm

Easy Rif... the 'breath scene' Gamble is referring to there is when Shepard wakes up after the beam, in the red, body filled tunnel.

;)

by Rifneno Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:00 am

CSSteele wrote:Easy Rif... the 'breath scene' Gamble is referring to there is when Shepard wakes up after the beam, in the red, body filled tunnel.

;)

If that a joke, or did that clown say that later?

by CSSteele Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:03 am

It was a joke, but a justification Gamble could use to say he wasn't lying; since the person who asked didn't specify what breath scene he specifically wanted an answer to.

Just .. possible double-talk. I speak it well, unfortunately.

by Rifneno Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:05 am

CSSteele wrote:It was a joke, but a justification Gamble could use to say he wasn't lying; since the person who asked didn't specify what breath scene he specifically wanted an answer to.

Just .. possible double-talk. I speak it well, unfortunately.

Ahh. Fair point. Though I was looking forward to seeing mag try to explain it. :(

by CSSteele Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:16 am

Sorry, I answered Mag's question for them, but ... seriously, unless he -is- saying that, he would be flat out lying, because we all know there's no way Shepard was where he says.

by Rifneno Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:21 am

CSSteele wrote:Sorry, I answered Mag's question for them, but ... seriously, unless he -is- saying that, he would be flat out lying, because we all know there's no way Shepard was where he says.

Well that's my point: he is flat out lying. Mike Gamble would rather climb a tree and get to tell a lie than stay on the ground and have to tell the truth. He once asked a video store why "Liar, Liar" was in the comedy section when he's clearly horror. Mike Gamble is a lying bastard.

by CSSteele Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:32 am

LOL. Seriously? Even if not, that's funny.

by **CoolioThane** Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:30 am

Rifneno wrote:
Raistlin Majere wrote:
magnetite wrote:
Raistlin Majere wrote:Magnetite:

I am sorry, but Shepard lying in a pile of rubble with no one wanting to clearly state whether it is the Citadel or Earth with the only clear thing being that he is alive and with no indication of what happens after is not what I call an ending to Shepard's story.

Watch the video I posted in the other thread. It's clearly on Earth. I don't know what people want though. For Shepard to destroy the Reapers for good? They said this is not what was going to happen.

No I am not asking for that, but finishing a story whether that be an overall epic tale or personal quest requires closure of some form.

You should be asking for that, because that's what they need to give us. "Mass Effect 3 isn't about the Reapers" is an utterly pathetic fanboy excuse. ME3 could not be more about the Reapers and their war.

But while we're at poor fanboy excuses, mag, let's hear an explanation for this that doesn't involve BW lying: https://twitter.com/GambleMike/status/352187404377001987

LOL just realised Priestly blocked me on twitter. I genuinely sent one negative tweet. No abuse or anything. That fat prick needs a fucking pole up his ass. What a nob

by **Hrothdane** Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:42 am

magnetite wrote:
Mass Effect 3 will end Shepard's story, not Reapers

I don't know what else to say. We paid $60 to have them write us a story. What are people going to do, hold Bioware hostage until they get what they want?

Thing is, Mass Effect 3 ended development back in March 2013. In the world of software development, Mass Effect 3 has reached it's end of life for the game. No new update, patches or content. They're done with this game.

People are fine to disagree on how they ended it, but to demand proper closure or have closure how we see fit. It's not our story to tell. I mean look, it's all about family dynamics:

-One guy likes the original endings
-One guy likes the extended cut
-One guy wants the entire ending rewritten
-One guy wants the entire game redone
-One guy wants to see X scene specifically for his Shepard (Tali house or whatever)

Change any one of those and someone will not be satisfied.

Even if it was "our story" like the claimed, who's the one who has to make and test all the content? Bioware.

Sorry, I'm a bit off my nut. I need to go lie down.

GameTrailers.com Delivers "The Final Verdict" On ME3 Ending - Page 2 E8a_zps887b5b67

by magnetite Wed Jul 31, 2013 5:02 am

Bullshit. They made claims about a product that turned out to be blatant lies. It's damn well within the consumer's right to demand what was promised to them.

So because you can't please everyone, don't even try to please anyone and don't even try to deliver on the claims you made to sell the product. Fanboy logic is as bad as Sevial logic.

It's like that with any business. You run a business where you try to make everyone happy, I don't think it'll last very long. Some customers just can't be satisfied. I mean look, Bioware spent a couple million at least on that EC. People weren't satisfied. Why would Bioware waste another couple million a second time? They wouldn't. Any smart business wouldn't.

Most of those ending claims can be summed up as "is the last 5 minutes the ending, or the whole game". People upset say "last 5 minutes", Bioware said "whole game". Customer uses that "customer is always right" (which I take it none of you ever worked in retail, because that catchphrase is complete horseshit, and won't get a business to turn things in your favor)

So they made some claims. I've had salesmen make false claims, but I guess I'm just a little more forgiving about stuff than others. If Bioware made 100 promises, but failed to keep one or two, then I'd be okay with that. It's not the end of the world. Now if they made 100 promises, but only kept maybe 10 of them, that's a different deal. Less than 4 promises? I'd cut them some slack. You should too.

No different than saying as a kid your mom promised to take you to the park today, but then she came back and said she had other plans. Kid throws a fit and says "you promised me!!". It kind of goes back to the whole marketing thing I said earlier, where companies make their products look better than they actually are. Just like my FSX example earlier, which was a lie, but no one held MS responsible or took to the streets demanding a "game that utilizes 256 cores to their full potential just like Microsoft promised". Or the pre-release screenshots which had the game running smooth as silk, but when people got it home, it ran worse than a WW2 tank (2 FPS on high settings).

Just get your refund and go home like most consumers. I have not known many consumers to go on about stuff for a year and a half. Honestly, at this point, regardless of what happened, Bioware does have the right to refuse service at this point. They don't owe people anything. They weren't able to satisfy you. Okay. So you take your money and buy from someone else. That's how capitalism works. I mean, I didn't like what Blizzard did to WoW since Cataclysm, so I stopped buying their games and bought from someone else. I didn't hold that against them forever. Live and let die.

Honestly, who cares what Mike said. Why don't people decide for themselves whether Shepard was on the Citadel or whether he was on Earth?

It just seems like people didn't really enjoy this game anyways, ending or not, because all they can seem to do is pick apart all the stuff wrong about it.

Just do me a favor, don't buy the next game. Whatever you do. Find another game, preferably one you enjoy. No point clinging to a game you hate. You'll thank me for it.

by Rifneno Wed Jul 31, 2013 11:51 am

magnetite wrote:It's like that with any business. You run a business where you try to make everyone happy, I don't think it'll last very long. Some customers just can't be satisfied. I mean look, Bioware spent a couple million at least on that EC. People weren't satisfied. Why would Bioware waste another couple million a second time? They wouldn't. Any smart business wouldn't.

Do you even read what you're replying to? Or do you just "use your imagination" and respond to whatever you think the voices in your head said? Because nobody said anything about them having to please everyone. Just like no one in that link you gave said what you claimed they said. No wonder you love Bioware so much, you must look up to them as superior liars.

Most of those ending claims can be summed up as "is the last 5 minutes the ending, or the whole game". People upset say "last 5 minutes", Bioware said "whole game".

No. Sycophants such as yourself said that.

Customer uses that "customer is always right" (which I take it none of you ever worked in retail, because that catchphrase is complete horseshit, and won't get a business to turn things in your favor)

NO ONE FUCKING SAID THAT. STOP MAKING SHIT UP. THE VOICES IN YOUR HEAD ARE NOT REAL. AM I GETTING THROUGH AT ALL?

So they made some claims. I've had salesmen make false claims, but I guess I'm just a little more forgiving about stuff than others. If Bioware made 100 promises, but failed to keep one or two, then I'd be okay with that. It's not the end of the world. Now if they made 100 promises, but only kept maybe 10 of them, that's a different deal. Less than 4 promises? I'd cut them some slack. You should too.

Fuck them, and fuck you if you think their idea of business is acceptable.

No different than saying as a kid your mom promised to take you to the park today, but then she came back and said she had other plans. Kid throws a fit and says "you promised me!!".

Your analogies suck almost as much as you do. They told blatant lies to sell a product. This isn't like any parenting situation. This is like a bad business situation, because that's what it is. Want a better link? It's like this article about corporations telling blatant lies. How about that one where Coke started selling sugar water under the name "VitaminWater" and claimed it gave all sorts of health benefits that it doesn't... that seems an apt analogy. And you know one of the big reasons corporations can get away with these things? Because shitbags like you refuse to hold them accountable. You make me sick.

It kind of goes back to the whole marketing thing I said earlier, where companies make their products look better than they actually are. Just like my FSX example earlier, which was a lie, but no one held MS responsible or took to the streets demanding a "game that utilizes 256 cores to their full potential just like Microsoft promised". Or the pre-release screenshots which had the game running smooth as silk, but when people got it home, it ran worse than a WW2 tank (2 FPS on high settings).

Just get your refund and go home like most consumers. I have not known many consumers to go on about stuff for a year and a half. Honestly, at this point, regardless of what happened, Bioware does have the right to refuse service at this point. They don't owe people anything. They weren't able to satisfy you. Okay. So you take your money and buy from someone else. That's how capitalism works. I mean, I didn't like what Blizzard did to WoW since Cataclysm, so I stopped buying their games and bought from someone else. I didn't hold that against them forever. Live and let die.

LOL. We're going to keep speaking our minds. And there's not a damn thing you can do about it, fanboy.
GameTrailers.com Delivers "The Final Verdict" On ME3 Ending - Page 2 5b6y69_zps9df2ef1a

GameTrailers.com Delivers "The Final Verdict" On ME3 Ending - Page 2 5b6y69_zps9df2ef1a

Honestly, who cares what Mike said. Why don't people decide for themselves whether Shepard was on the Citadel or whether he was on Earth?

The rest of us don't have all those voices and hallucinations of reality to entertain us. We want an actual canon. That's why we got into a series; because we wanted to see a story, not make one up ourselves. Why did you even buy the game if you're just going to make up drivel?

It just seems like people didn't really enjoy this game anyways, ending or not, because all they can seem to do is pick apart all the stuff wrong about it.

Just do me a favor, don't buy the next game. Whatever you do. Find another game, preferably one you enjoy. No point clinging to a game you hate. You'll thank me for it.

I'll probably pirate it. Because BW owes me one. $Javik\'s trolling$

by BlueLogic Wed Jul 31, 2013 3:09 pm

magnetite wrote:Just get your refund and go home like most consumers. I have not known many consumers to go on about stuff for a year and a half.

What's even more odd is someone who apparently doesn't care but feels a desperate need to tell others they shouldn't either.

magnetite wrote:Honestly, at this point, regardless of what happened, Bioware does have the right to refuse service at this point. They don't owe people anything. They weren't able to satisfy you. Okay. So you take your money and buy from someone else. That's how capitalism works.

I like your cape.

magnetite wrote:Honestly, who cares what Mike said. Why don't people decide for themselves whether Shepard was on the Citadel or whether he was on Earth?

Because, after avoiding addressing questions directly for over a year, he finally delivers an answer both unambiguous and utterly nonsensical. Unhelpful for anyone.

magnetite wrote:It just seems like people didn't really enjoy this game anyways, ending or not, because all they can seem to do is pick apart all the stuff wrong about it.

Didn't you just...hang on a sec...yeah.

magnetite wrote:Most of those ending claims can be summed up as "is the last 5 minutes the ending, or the whole game". People upset say "last 5 minutes", Bioware said "whole game".

This entire site is dedicated to discussing the ending. Which, as you've just pointed out, comprises the "last 5 minutes" of the game. So, I answer your assertion with your prior assertion.

by **Hrothdane** Sat Aug 03, 2013 7:45 am

Unless something big changes,

GameTrailers.com Delivers "The Final Verdict" On ME3 Ending - Page 2 B36_zps01dc6983

by Rifneno Sat Aug 03, 2013 11:56 am

Hrothdane wrote:Unless something big changes,

I can't imagine anything big enough for me to give them more money. They didn't just ruin the series in 5 minutes, they've treated the fans like complete shit on so many things. For example, this one came up in chat recently and it still steams me just to think about it. As anyone who's played ME3MP knows, geth hunter mode has an... interesting visual effect. The visual effect gave a lot of users headaches, vertigo, sometimes outright migraines. There was a 60-some page petition on the MP forum of people asking for it to be changed. You'd think "your poorly designed visual causes me physical pain because the human eye was not designed for that shit" would be a good reason to have something changed. This is the reason the Virtual Boy was the biggest failure in video game history FFS. But no. After 60-some pages, Chris Cuntly comes in and says no, and if people don't like it then they should play something else. And while it's easy to just say Priestly is a piece of human garbage (and lord is he), the fact is that was Bioware's official response to a serious issue. A lot of people made a lot of stink over it. The MP devs (and most likely the other devs) knew about it, and they decided that we should go fuck ourselves. Lardass was just the messenger. IIRC, there wasn't even an apology for making such a godawful design. No "We're very sorry about this, but we don't have the budget to patch it at the moment" or anything, just "Go play something else then."

I can't fathom what they could do that would convince me to give those motherfuckers money ever again.

by Ithurael Sat Dec 13, 2014 9:39 pm

Rifneno wrote:

<snip>
I can't fathom what they could do that would convince me to give those motherfuckers money ever again.

Well..apparently it just took a few years and a new Dragon Age game lol.

You guys are silly.

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