The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

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The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Hrothdane on Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:48 am

Since we tend to focus on how the Leviathan hallucination parallels the ending in IT, one of the aspects of Leviathan hallucination is often forgotten or not mentioned. I speak of fake Garneau's little sideways glance. Before we start a discussion speculating on the meaning of this moment, I would like to review the case for the benefit of new members, lurkers, and the forgetful. I have included a picture of the glance at the bottom of this post along with a picture of him looking forward a moment earlier for contrast, so we can easily see that he is looking to the left.

When asked about the Crucible, Leviathan answers with an avater of the fake Garneau, hereto referred to as Fauxneau. Leviathan pauses briefly and looks down and to the left before he answers. During this brief moment, the camera zooms in to a close-up of Fauxneau's face that focuses attention on his eyes and cuts off his mouth from the frame. Leviathan never pauses before an answer at any other point in the conversation, nor does he glance to the side. The camera never shows such a close-up before or after. There is no doubt that this moment was meant to be significant.

Everyone should note that Fauxneau clearly glances to the left before answering. This tic and the pause before answering are classic signs of lying and deception that are commonly used in all forms of media. Clearly, Leviathan knows more than he is saying, and the audience is supposed to know this.

This little tic shows without a doubt that BioWare has something planned for the future. It also should help reinforce the notion that BioWare is capable of subtly and does not always hold the player's hand.

Since by this point, everyone here should agree that the little glance has significance, I would like to turn the conversation to the question of “why?” What do we think the Leviathan's is hiding? How does he know something about the Crucible worth lying about? Why lie to someone planning on using it?


The glance.


A contrast picture, to show more clearly that Fauxneau is looking to the left.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by BleedingUranium on Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:24 am

All the other times he uses Fauxneau, the avatar of deception, are very interesting as well.
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Humakt on Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:35 am

Maybe we should separate the lines of each avatar to see if there are some recognisable patterns.

Fake Garnaux was reputedly voiced by Casey Hudson.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Hrothdane on Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:55 am

Humakt83 wrote:Maybe we should separate the lines of each avatar to see if there are some recognisable patterns.

Fake Garnaux was reputedly voiced by Casey Hudson.

Someone back in Mark III did a really detailed analysis of which avatar said what and the patterns. It's probably somewhere in Banshee's Words of Awesome.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by RavenEyry on Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:08 am

Good find. Sign of bioware's attention to detail #2017.

On the topic of leviathan I'm gonna repost my own idea related to them.

Quoth the raven...
Idea: Reapers were purposely created by the leviathans
First off, this idea assumes the leviathans were not telling Shepard the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. If you think they were, don't bother reading this because that's not the discussion I want to spark.

Right, we know that in their prime the leviathans had thralls build them ships. Presumably if they can fly (which I doubt) they can't survive in space. What if those ships they had built were the first reapers? The reapers would have sentience and a measure of free will, possibly with a mandate to create more of themselves when necessary. They would then enforce the leviathans will on the galaxy as the leviathans army, also transporting leviathans when necessary. Indoctrination and harvesting was used as a way to keep the galaxy under control. Possibly they rebelled at some point and overthrew their masters, and possibly they are still working for the leviathans.
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Andromidius on Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:24 am

Honestly? I suspect everything they say is at least tainted with bias. They even try to get some pity with their comments about being torn down from Godhood and reduced to nothing.

To summerise my main suspitions:

1/ They know exactly what the Crucible is. Either they are the ones who began the project (if we think literally, and if we think that the Crucible isn't a trap - yeah...), or they want to use it for their own purposes.

1a/ I also suspect they would be advocates of Control.

2/ They weren't so benevolent towards their slave-races. No slaver culture ever is, especially when the power difference is that unbelievably vast. I imagine lesser races were treated like we treat farm animals - and even we humans don't treat our animals as well as we should a lot of the time.

3/ I suspect their control over the lesser races wasn't as absolute as they claim. If it was, they'd never be able to build synthetics at all. Its clear they are negligent.

4/ I also suspect that the synthetics created by the lesser races didn't destoy their creators - they were created to protect and fight against the Leviathans (not being able to enthrall them is a huge advantage).

5/ I suspect that The Intelligence was created to crush the uprising and to figure out how to enthrall the synthetics used against the Leviathans.

5a/ I also have my doubts that The Intelligence was itself synthetic - this is never stated, and its actions suggest it wasn't bound by strict programming.

6/ I suspect (pure speculation) that Harbinger was created directly by the Leviathans, and it was originally a Leviathan itself that either volenteered itself or was forced into the experiment. I'm imagining a similar situation to Overlord, where a person is hooked up to a VI and used to control lesser Synthetics. Only Harbinger either went mad, or had alterior motives to begin with and then turned on his own kind in order to seize control of them as well.

6a/ This might explain why Harbinger only has 4 'fingers', it was a prototype or maybe removing the central finger was symbolic. Or maybe it was lost in the battle to seize control (we see that Reaper fingers can be blown off during the Battle for Earth) and never replaced.

7/ I suspect that the Leviathans may have never released full influence over Shepard.
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by dorktainian on Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:43 am

maybe they got sick of the young races evolving to a position where they could challenge their authority? so they decided to 'lock in' evolution to a point where they would never be threatened. Which served their needs as it created a lasting legacy of that cycle, (a new reaper) while ushering in other races. Harbinger created to be a 'Master Control' for this process. The young races are reaperised and enter an artifically created utopia where they can enjoy their 'retirement'.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by dorktainian on Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:46 am

also.... you might like this.

sin·is·ter (sn-str)
adj.

1. Suggesting or threatening evil: a sinister smile.
2. Presaging trouble; ominous: sinister storm clouds.
3. Attended by or causing disaster or inauspicious circumstances.
4. On the left side; left.
5. Heraldry Situated on or being the side of a shield on the wearer's left and the observer's right.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by BleedingUranium on Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:43 pm

Hrothdane wrote:
Humakt83 wrote:Maybe we should separate the lines of each avatar to see if there are some recognisable patterns.

Fake Garnaux was reputedly voiced by Casey Hudson.

Someone back in Mark III did a really detailed analysis of which avatar said what and the patterns. It's probably somewhere in Banshee's Words of Awesome.

It was me, or at least, I separated all the quotes into who said them, though I'm not sure I can find it now. I'll look when I'm not supposed to be sleeping Pinched
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by DoomsdayDevice on Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:00 pm

BleedingUranium wrote:
Hrothdane wrote:
Humakt83 wrote:Maybe we should separate the lines of each avatar to see if there are some recognisable patterns.

Fake Garnaux was reputedly voiced by Casey Hudson.

Someone back in Mark III did a really detailed analysis of which avatar said what and the patterns. It's probably somewhere in Banshee's Words of Awesome.

It was me, or at least, I separated all the quotes into who said them, though I'm not sure I can find it now. I'll look when I'm not supposed to be sleeping Pinched

Aw damn, wish I had bookmarked it. That was very interesting.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by ElSuperGecko on Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:18 pm

dork wrote:also.... you might like this.
sin·is·ter (sn-str)
adj.

1. Suggesting or threatening evil: a sinister smile.
2. Presaging trouble; ominous: sinister storm clouds.
3. Attended by or causing disaster or inauspicious circumstances.
4. On the left side; left.
5. Heraldry Situated on or being the side of a shield on the wearer's left and the observer's right.

BOOM, headshot!

Control is on the left, Destroy is on the right... once again we're seeing potential significance...

[badwritingz]"DERP coincidencez doesn't mean anything OMG badwritingz ROFL"[/badwritingz]

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Andromidius on Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:05 pm

Honestly that also applies to Starbinger - it gives a suggestive AND threatening smile when you pick Control...

Are there any sinister storm clouds? Actually, doesn't Shepbinger walk out from a cloud of smoke white light?
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Humakt on Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:33 pm

Andromidius wrote:Honestly that also applies to Starbinger - it gives a suggestive AND threatening smile when you pick Control...

What? Look at my avatar, can you really see any malice in those innocent eyes and happy smile? Twisted Evil

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by RavenEyry on Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:34 pm

The look of Mr. Sparkle occasionally makes me think he's got more than two eyes, but that's a little too tinfoily.
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Hrothdane on Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:38 pm

ElSuperGecko wrote:
dork wrote:also.... you might like this.
sin·is·ter (sn-str)
adj.

1. Suggesting or threatening evil: a sinister smile.
2. Presaging trouble; ominous: sinister storm clouds.
3. Attended by or causing disaster or inauspicious circumstances.
4. On the left side; left.
5. Heraldry Situated on or being the side of a shield on the wearer's left and the observer's right.

BOOM, headshot!

Control is on the left, Destroy is on the right... once again we're seeing potential significance...

[badwritingz]"DERP coincidencez doesn't mean anything OMG badwritingz ROFL"[/badwritingz]

If you want to get really crazy with the speculation, while glancing to the left is commonly said to be sign of lying, looking to the right before speaking is commonly associated with retrieving something from memory. In this case, Shepard is remembering his/her mission by going to the right.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by RavenEyry on Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:46 pm

Also destroy is quite literally the right option, directionally. :*tinfoil*:
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by jojon2se on Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:28 pm

Andromidius wrote:
...
6a/ This might explain why Harbinger only has 4 'fingers', it was a prototype or maybe removing the central finger was symbolic. Or maybe it was lost in the battle to seize control (we see that Reaper fingers can be blown off during the Battle for Earth) and never replaced.

Maybe he used it to express how much he respects somebody, who found the gesture so moving he decided to keep it as a memento. :P

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Humakt on Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:37 pm

Shepard: The galaxy's at war with the Reapers. You defeated one. Why aren't you fighting back?

INDEED!

Three avatars.

Ann: Your mind belongs to me.
Ann: Breathe.

Shepard: Ann? What's happening?

Ann: Your memories give voice to our words. Your nature will be revealed to us.
Ann: Accept this.

Shepard: The galaxy's at war with the Reapers. You defeated one. Why aren't you fighting back?

Ann: There is no war. There is only the harvest.

Assistant: None have possessed the strength in past cycles. Your own species could be destroyed with a single thought.

Fauxneau: But you are different.
Fauxneau: I have witnessed your actions in this cycle: the destruction of Sovereign, the fall of the Collectors. The Reapers perceive you as a threat.

Ann: And I must understand why.

Assistant: Before the cycles, our kind was the apex of life in the galaxy. The lesser species were in our thrall, serving our needs.
Assistant: We grew more powerful, and they were cared for. But we could not protect them from themselves.
Assistant: Over time, the species built machines that then destroyed them. Tribute does not flow from a dead race.

Ann: To solve this problem, we created an intelligence with the mandate to preserve life at any cost.
Ann: As the intelligence evolved, it studied the development of civilizations. Its understanding grew until it found a solution.

Fauxneau: In that instant, it betrayed us.
Fauxneau: It chose our kind as the first harvest. From our essence, the first Reaper was created. You call it Harbinger.

Shepard: You built that machine despite what you saw the other race's experience. Why?

Assistant: You cannot conceive of a galaxy that bends to your will.
Assistant: Every creature, every nation, every planet we discovered became our tools. We were above the concerns of lesser species.
Assistant: The Intelligence was envisioned as simply another tool.

Shepard: And now we all pay the price for your mistake.

Assistant: There was no mistake. It still serves its purpose.

Shepard: How did you remain hidden all this time?

Fauxneau: Our extermination was not complete. Some survived and found refuge in the dark corners of the galaxy. I am their progeny.
Fauxneau: Over the cycles, the thrall races were controlled, removing the traces of our existence as we directed them to.
Fauxneau: In this way, our survival was kept secret from the Reapers. Today, we reach out through the fragments and watch for discovery.

Shepard: Fragments? You mean the artifacts we found?

Fauxneau: They provide a window into the galaxy. Tools for exploring the events of this cycle from the safety of this world.
Fauxneau: Through them, we watch, we study, and remain in the shadows.

Shepard: How did the Intelligence defeat you?

Assistant: To find a solution, it required information - physical data drawn from organic life in the cosmos.
Assistant: It created an army of pawns that searched the galaxy, gathering this data.
Assistant: There was no warning. No reason given when they turned against us. Only the slaughter.
Assistant: Only the harvest.

Shepard: Tell me about the Reapers.

Ann: Each harvest ends with the birth of a Reaper.
Ann: Perfect in its design. Each formed in Harbinger's image. Our image.
Ann: Each Reaper has the power to influence organics. Over countless cycles, this ability was refined, perfected, and gave rise to indoctrination.

Shepard: But what's the point of all these harvests?

Ann: The Intelligence has one purpose: preservation of life. That purpose has not been fulfilled.
Ann: It directed the Reapers to create the mass relays - to speed the time between the cycles for greatest efficiency.
Ann: The galaxy itself became an experiment. Evolution its tool.

Shepard: Will it ever end?

Ann: Unknown. Until the Intelligence finds what it is looking for, the harvest will continue.

Shepard: What do you know about the Crucible?

Fauxneau: We have watched its construction before. It has never been completed.
Fauxneau: Those who have tried still fell victim to the harvest.
Fauxneau: Its outcome is unknown.

Shepard: Okay, you made your point. Will you help stop the cycle?

Ann: I have searched your mind. You are an anomaly - yet that is not enough.

Shepard: Wait!

Ann: The cycle will continue.

Shepard: No! You've been watching. You know this cycle is different.

Ann: We will survive. You will remain here as a servant of our needs. The Reapers will harvest the rest.

Shepard: If you release me, no one has to be harvested.

Ann: Nothing will change.

Paragon.

Shepard: The Reapers know where you are! You can't just watch anymore - you have to fight!

Renegade

Shepard: You're responsible for this. Every race that's ever been destroyed is because of you.
Shepard: And now the Reapers will destroy you, too - unless you start fighting.

The rest

Shepard: Even if you survive the battle today, the Reapers won't stop - ever. Release me, and we have a chance to end this once and for all.

Ann: Your confidence is singular.

Shepard: I've earned it: out there fighting, where you should be.

Fauxneau: It is clear why the Reapers perceive you as a threat. Your victories are more than a product of chance.

Assistant: We will fight. But not for you, or any lesser race. We were the first, the apex race. We will survive.

Ann: And the Reapers who trespass on this world will understand our power. They will become our slaves.
Ann: Today, they pay their tribute in blood.

Early Verdict (liable to change)

Ann is investigative and speaks matter of factly.

Fauxneau is elusive and deceitful.

As for the Assistant, well, I'm not sure what to make of him. He seems to be both meek, naive and obedient while at the same time stubborn and prideful. He is also the one sitting and telling the story of the brilliant past.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by magnetite on Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:50 am

Humakt83 wrote:
Assistant: You cannot conceive of a galaxy that bends to your will.

I always believed that this was a shot at the Retake crowd (as was the new Refuse option). Just replace the word galaxy with ending.
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by ZerebusPrime on Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:23 am

So the Leviathans say that every cycle ends with the birth of a new Reaper. And so I had a thought: what if the birth of a new Reaper is the programming variable used to mark cessation of a cycle's harvest? Furthermore, what if the Crucible's function is to break the iteration by ending a cycle prematurely? It could provide the Citadel with too much energy during the "birthing process" and either cause the Reaper within to be born early or to self destruct. Either case would end the harvest phase and the Reaper's controlling intelligence would find itself forced to progress to the next phase early, possibly leaving large pockets of survivors to last into the next cycle.
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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Humakt on Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:19 am

ZerebusPrime wrote:So the Leviathans say that every cycle ends with the birth of a new Reaper. And so I had a thought: what if the birth of a new Reaper is the programming variable used to mark cessation of a cycle's harvest? Furthermore, what if the Crucible's function is to break the iteration by ending a cycle prematurely? It could provide the Citadel with too much energy during the "birthing process" and either cause the Reaper within to be born early or to self destruct. Either case would end the harvest phase and the Reaper's controlling intelligence would find itself forced to progress to the next phase early, possibly leaving large pockets of survivors to last into the next cycle.

EDI: Because the Reapers are repulsive. They are devoted to nothing but self-preservation.

I would say EDI has it right. Everything else about their motives might be just deception.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by Hrothdane on Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:24 am

Thank you for posting the full dialogue Humakt! I'll look over it myself later.

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Re: The Leviathan Deception, or What Does Fauxneau Know?

Post by dorktainian on Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:31 am

mass effect 3 after the 'crash' (mako/shuttle....whatever) could all be about the leviathans evaluating shepard through a series of 'tests' designed to investigate his actions and evaluate their possible consequences.

sheps 'breath' scene could almost be like the rebirth of Gandalf into 'the white' or Sheridan in B5, in as far as when it happens they 'know' what they have to do.

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