(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV!

Damn it's getting heated in here.
All I can say is that I hope to God this leak is a pile of bullshit.

i'm going for nacho's....  This will be entertaining.

Rifneno wrote:

That's one hell of a wordy "no."

You admittedly haven't played ACBH either.

Rifneno wrote:
People who, unlike you and the fraud who wrote that fake rumor, are not complete idiots.  They know what they're talking about.  They may be lying assholes, but they're not idiots.  The reason they post Hubble photos and chime in on space colonizaion debates is the same reason they wouldn't make so stupid a mistake as to call it "solar systems": because reasonably realistic sci-fi is a personal interest and passion for them.  That's how they ended up doing it for a living.  That's why there's puns about asari blue-shifting that 0.1% of the players will get.  That's why things like QEC have a real scientific foundation.  That's why they're not living in a basement like the jackass who wrote this review you're pleasuring yourself over because being right is such a rare occurrence for you that it warrants such celebration and defense.

Lol yes do you know that QEC theories at it's current state have verifiable data to support the notion that faster than light communication of the classic type is not possible? Therefore what was shown in ME was pure fiction of communication in real time between star systems when illusive man was talking to you from his station in some other star system while you are several light years away from his hide out.

Writers are not scientists. Uh yeah according to you, sit back in your couch and read little articles on the subject and you are an automatic expert eh? No the real fool here is you. The writers take inspiration from popular subjects in science and try to weave it in to their story, it's fiction remember?

Scientific pedantics are not required for a survey just like it is not needed for a complete work of fiction.

Rifneno wrote: You didn't make any fucking point, and I'm not entertaining your neurosis.

Simply restating this over and over doesn't make it magically fact am not the one who made the survey post. The point I made was this sort of stuff has already happened once so there is a good chance this could another one of those and so people will talk about it but if that makes you mad then tough luck.

Rifneno wrote:
What. The. Fuck.  Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with you?  Did your mother chug battery acid when she was pregnant?!

Ah yes when one doesn't have something meaningful to add, engage in pointless insults. You need to take a break you've lost it already.

Rifneno wrote:
Am I the only one that remembers things that happened prior to last week?

Like what?

Rifneno wrote:
They made no argument, and neither did you.  Just fantasizing in public about being right.

Nope they posed a question and you lost the argument by losing your cool, swears and insults are not the valid answer for their question. They are not public either just people who oppose IT, again you seem clueless about how to categorize the groups. Public opinion is varying with no real consensuses some IT, some literal, some against IT, some just don't care and many many more with their own theories to put forward.

Rifneno wrote:
Bullshit.  Writers' word is not law.

Oh yes, sorry forgot that MEU just fell out from the sky to bioware, no one actually thought  through and made the story. Drew Karphyshyn was engaging in the rituals to gain insught from the higher powers to get the stories of the MEU. There was no such thing as canned story arcs like dark energy plot getting canned because it never existed. Right thanks for the wisdom.

Rifneno wrote:
Further, I don't give a damn about public opinion, I give a damn about the truth.

Lol don't think too highly of yourself I am sure they don't care either about yours just the same but that's not what we are talking about and you know it.

Hold on, whats this?, you don't give a damn about the truth? So if your worst fears are confirmed you'll just ignore it and be grumpy? Well that's what I have been saying, you don't have to like it and neither do I, but IF that's the direction bioware wants to take now then that's their loss.

Rifneno wrote:
You seem confused.  In more ways than one.  I'm not the one pretending I can guess with some great accuracy what BW is doing: you are.  You're the one saying they're doing this stupid plot, and I'm not saying what they are do just that they aren't doing one idiotic thing.

You might need to take heed of your own advice Rif, no one here seems to be saying that post on reddit is fact only opinions that it could be legit and more hints and signs from Bioware with their encouragement of debates to fan the speculation further. I am even considering the possibility it is well crafted fake.  You on the other hand are so full of yourself that you know what Bioware is going to do next and somehow mistakes and oversights can never happen at Bioware. Well then do tell us what is the next game going to be about, very interested to know.

Rifneno wrote:
I guess we can add statistics and probability to the list of things you don't understand.  At all.

Ahem don't go there you obviously don't know anything about probability.


P(Rif) = (The Number Of Ways Event A Can Occur/The total number Of Possible Outcomes)

P(Rif) = 1/2 = 0.5

P(Reddit) = 1- P(Rif)
               = 0.5

Two outcomes 1) you are right 2) you are wrong (means the Reddit post is right)

Rifneno wrote:No, the reason it's getting attention is because people are idiots.

Charming, anyone who thinks about something you don't like is an Idiot. Good to know what's going on inside that bubble of yours.

Rifneno wrote:
Like I'd have to be to keep reading your nonsense after you brushed off not being careful with nukes because there's no NDA's.  Come to think of it, I probably shouldn't have bothered using the Kubrick example.  Although I suppose it'll be fun to see your insane troll logic on why it's totally different.

You are awfully mad Rif, you are barking up the wrong tree. If you have an issue take it up with the guy who posted the leak but don't get worked up at people who are talking about it.

OneWithTheAssassins wrote:Damn it's getting heated in here.
All I can say is that I hope to God this leak is a pile of bullshit.

It doesn't have to be heated between people here, what needs to be heated is the fan rejection to this survey leak post so these people at Bioware know we don't take such crap if they are really intending to go this route.

Unfortunately it seems there is enough noise of approvals to this nonsense.

Guys, it's just a depry ass video game. Chill your tits with the insults.

TurianRebel212 wrote:Guys, it's just a depry ass video game. Chill your tits with the insults.

Right, I think I have made the case really clear. It's a video game, it's fiction and them Bioware can do whatever they please with it. If it turns out good, they will get my money if not they wont simple.

windsurfing wrote:

TurianRebel212 wrote:Guys, it's just a depry ass video game. Chill your tits with the insults.

Right, I think I have made the case really clear. It's a video game, it's fiction and them Bioware can do whatever they please with it. If it turns out good, they will get my money if not they wont simple.

Yep. At the end of the day, it's their creative medium and they can do whatever they want. But.... It's my money and they can eat a fat dick, cause I ain't giving them a dime, lol.


*I will pirate it tho, you know, just for teh lulz*

TurianRebel212 wrote:
Yep. At the end of the day, it's their creative medium and they can do whatever they want. But.... It's my money and they can eat a fat dick, cause I ain't giving them a dime, lol.

*I will pirate it tho, you know, just for teh lulz*

Yeah but you sort of wish there are less people jumping in joy reading that stuff on reddit thinking it is the best thing to go forward with.

About piracy hmm maybe it wont come to that, we'll get to know very soon from the trailers if this thing is a total cop-out or not.

windsurfing wrote:

TurianRebel212 wrote:
Yep. At the end of the day, it's their creative medium and they can do whatever they want. But.... It's my money and they can eat a fat dick, cause I ain't giving them a dime, lol.

*I will pirate it tho, you know, just for teh lulz*

Yeah but you sort of wish there are less people jumping in joy reading that stuff on reddit thinking it is the best thing to go forward with.

About piracy hmm maybe it wont come to that, we'll get to know very soon from the trailers if this thing is a total co-out or not.

I stay away from Reddit and IGN as much as I can. Those places are riddled with scrubs and toxic thinkers. So I could care less what other people think about what BioWare is going forward with, I've seen the reaction here and that's really all I need to know.


I think it's a bad idea and move. And so does everyone else pretty much. But.... I'm a die-hard IT'er so, no shocker there.

Honestly, I'm nearly as disappointed with the multiplayer as I am about no Shepard and pals. They're just doing more of the same horde mode and coop suite for the MP. I think that's lame.


As it stands, I'm not impressed with BioWare. I wasn't impressed with Dragon Age Bugquisition and ME4 is looking to be underwhelming as well.

windsurfing wrote:You admittedly haven't played ACBH either.

Doesn't matter, you're the one who brought them into the comparison, fuck-o. And while we're on that topic, we were discussing this in chat and those that did play both found your comparison laughable. So yeah, not much confidence there.

The point, which I'm sure was wholly lost on you, is that "things changed, BW sucks now" isn't true because DA:I didn't suck. Nobody, and I mean nobody was expecting a bigger failure out of DA:I than I was. If a little midget jumped out of the DA:I box, stabbed you with an AIDS-infected needle, then sang about what a whore your mother is, I would've given the game credit for entertaining me in unexpected ways. But even I had to admit, it was a good game. It wasn't ME1/2 quality but nothing else is (IMO). It does, however, stand up against BW's earlier work like DAO and BG2.

Lol yes do you know that QEC theories at it's current state have verifiable data to support the notion that faster than light communication of the classic type is not possible? Therefore what was shown in ME was pure fiction of communication in real time between star systems when illusive man was talking to you from his station in some other star system while you are several light years away from his hide out.

In other words, it might not work as shown in sci-fi. Holy shit, really? You think? We haven't done proper research into QEC and we won't until we're out of the solar system. There's just no point in it while we're stuck on Earth and there's not going to be much point when we're colonizing the rest of the solar system.

Writers are not scientists. Uh yeah according to you, sit back in your couch and read little articles on the subject and you are an automatic expert eh? No the real fool here is you. The writers take inspiration from popular subjects in science and try to weave it in to their story, it's fiction remember?

I didn't say I was an expert, I said you were an idiot. There's a difference.

Scientific pedantics are not required for a survey just like it is not needed for a complete work of fiction.

I didn't say it was necessary, I said the writers aren't an idiot like you are and wouldn't make such a stupid mistake.

Simply restating this over and over doesn't make it magically fact

No, the fact it's a fact makes it a fact.

"Let me ask you this, what would you have to say if they got 80-90% of the most important plot details correct as reported in this supposed survey? Now before you say it would be a fluke guess, that would be a desperately weak argument."

You aren't making any point at all, you're just daydreaming about winning an argument.

The point I made was this sort of stuff has already happened once so there is a good chance this could another one of those and so people will talk about it but if that makes you mad then tough luck.

Oh, you actually think you're angering me? That explains the idiotic emoticons. No, I'm not "mad." I always curse constantly and I don't hold on my tongue on calling idiots what they are.

Ah yes when one doesn't have something meaningful to add, engage in pointless insults. You need to take a break you've lost it already.

Deal with it. This isn't the high school debate team, which I'm sure you weren't welcome at either.

Like what?

Like the things you didn't respond to because you had no counterargument. Like the fact that your bleeting BW didn't deny it was extra strength stupid since BW has only denied things that were actually true. Like the fact you hilariously claimed that the Andromeda picture was obviously a response to this "leak" when it was posted 3 fucking months ago. I can be polite if I so desire; you can't be smart.

Nope they posed a question and you lost the argument by losing your cool, swears and insults are not the valid answer for their question. They are not public either just people who oppose IT, again you seem clueless about how to categorize the groups. Public opinion is varying with no real consensuses some IT, some literal, some against IT, some just don't care and many many more with their own theories to put forward.

Cry some more. It's amusing.

Oh yes, sorry forgot that MEU just fell out from the sky to bioware, no one actually thought  through and made the story. Drew Karphyshyn was engaging in the rituals to gain insught from the higher powers to get the stories of the MEU. There was no such thing as canned story arcs like dark energy plot getting canned because it never existed. Right thanks for the wisdom.

You're aware that the people reading your stupidity are also reading the posts you're responding to, right? I don't know who you think careful editing is fooling. God you're an idiot.

I give a damn about the truth.

Hold on, whats this?, you don't give a damn about the truth?

Reading comprehension: 0/10

So if your worst fears are confirmed you'll just ignore it and be grumpy? Well that's what I have been saying, you don't have to like it and neither do I, but IF that's the direction bioware wants to take now then that's their loss.

No, if they ruin the series then it's everyone's loss. Theirs and ours.

You might need to take heed of your own advice Rif, no one here seems to be saying that post on reddit is fact only opinions that it could be legit and more hints and signs from Bioware with their encouragement of debates to fan the speculation further. I am even considering the possibility it is well crafted fake.  You on the other hand are so full of yourself that you know what Bioware is going to do next and somehow mistakes and oversights can never happen at Bioware. Well then do tell us what is the next game going to be about, very interested to know.

I'm not an idiot, I'm well aware of the possibility that Ark theory is correct. I'm aware of the possibility that ME4 will turn out to be an RTS wherein the most valuable resource is bananas. What we're arguing about is the probability. You, and many others here, keep raving about "Bioderp" and how they're going to do the most idiotic things. I see very little evidence to actually support the idea that after 3 incredible games, they're going to pull a DA2. Even after the most development time BW has ever given a game (ultra short development time being the reason most people give for DA2 being worse than Hitler and Stalin's gay lovechild). And I'm more than a little tired of hearing the same pessimistic crap day in and day out for months. That should set off some alarm bells alone since I've never been described as optimistic by anyone, ever, for any reason.

Ahem don't go there you obviously don't know anything about probability.


P(Rif) = (The Number Of Ways Event A Can Occur/The total number Of Possible Outcomes)

P(Rif) = 1/2 = 0.5

P(Reddit) = 1- P(Rif)
               = 0.5

Two outcomes 1) you are right 2) you are wrong (means the Reddit post is right)

Right, the amount of possible outcomes is the only variable in the equation. Tomorrow, I'm going to buy a bunch of lottery tickets and spend the rest of the day asking famous actresses if they want to be fuck buddies. 50% chance of succeeding at anything is awesome.

Charming, anyone who thinks about something you don't like is an Idiot. Good to know what's going on inside that bubble of yours.

You are awfully mad Rif, you are barking up the wrong tree. If you have an issue take it up with the guy who posted the leak but don't get worked up at people who are talking about it.

I'm not mad, I'm just caustic. It beats being stupid though.

As i'm 47, I've been around for pretty much the entire history of video gaming.  From the humble ZX81, to the BBC Micro, the ZX Spectrum 48K, The Atari 2600, The Sega Master System, The Sega Megadrive, Super Nintendo, The Nintendo 64, The Playstation, The PS2, The PS3, The PS4, The PC...etc...

It used to be exciting when a game came out.

I don't get that feeling anymore.  Well not since Mass Effect 3 anyways.

Thank you Bioware.

dorktainian wrote:As i'm 47, I've been around for pretty much the entire history of video gaming.  From the humble ZX81, to the BBC Micro, the ZX Spectrum 48K, The Atari 2600, The Sega Master System, The Sega Megadrive, Super Nintendo, The Nintendo 64, The Playstation, The PS2, The PS3, The PS4, The PC...etc...

It used to be exciting when a game came out.

I don't get that feeling anymore.  Well not since Mass Effect 3 anyways.

Thank you Bioware.

Yeah, but it's not just you. It's mostly every "older" gamer. Jim Sterling had a vid about it for his recent jimquisition centered around Battlefront.

The game industry is, for all intents and purposes, a joke at this point. It's infested with Twitch/youtube Bait, DLC schemes, boring cliche's and game mechanics ("cinematic" quality, Call of Duty,QTE's,Season passes, remakes of gen 7 games for gen 8 consoles.... "premium" or "elite" services, "deep" characters and so on and so on, lol). Game sales, as in actual games being sold, have been on the decline since 2011. But the industry makes up for it with DLC and season passes, lol. Also, the "AAA" games are becoming less and less in terms of not just numbers, but quality as well.

2014, will be remembered for the year of the bugged and broken game releases. Today's "AAA" games come with a substantial amount of bugs and issues. This is creating customer dissatisfaction and erosion of brand loyalty.

Like you, I used to get excited about the new HALO, or Mass Effect, or Battlefield or Batman or whatever new AAA game it may have been.

But now..... I just want the games to work and not be broken.


Sad state of gaming. Lets hope for the industry's sake, that it improves drastically. And soon.

I have noticed the same tendency for myself, though with some exceptions.

Some games, or rather some developers, have consistently delivered great experiences in my eyes. At the moment this list is mostly FromSoftware and Platinum Games (though with a fluke in the later case, the Legend of Korra game).

Whenever either of these two reveal a game I feel I can reasonably allow myself to anticipate it as chances are it will be good.

Bioware was once on this list. Then DA2 happened, then ME3 and its ending which made me drop them.

A few individual titles get the same reaction from me, mostly Legend of Zelda games.

But in almost all cases I limit how much information I look up for the game. I watch the announcement trailer and a gameplay trailer and then basically drop it, just keeping barely any tabs on the interested game, keeping the experience fresh for when it arrives. This way I can anticipate the game, without feeling like half the game has been shown to me and burning out.

Even so I always look at reviews before ordering these days, preferably user reviews.

DLC is mostly a case to case basis for me, judging what exactly I get for what money. Pre-order bonuses that are anything but cosmetic is the plague to me though and a major deal breaker.

Raistlin Majere wrote:

Eryri wrote:

dorktainian wrote:https://twitter.com/The1Wynn/status/552631957704941568

It's looking more like Andromeda.

by Eryri Today at 21:19  " The only way I would have an interest in this, is if the colonists in Andromeda amass such a massive arsenal of alien tech that they decided to go back to the Milky Way to fight the Reapers properly, and find an indoctrinated Shepard waiting for them."

Feasible?

Probably not in terms of lore, as the trip there and back would take too long. It depends on how much Space Magic / Timey Wimey stuff Bioware might be willing to apply. I'll admit I'd be prepared to overlook a fair bit of that though, if it meant resolving Shepard's arc properly.

Even then there would be some serious wallbangers involved.

An entire established galaxy of infrastructure and fleets cant fight the Reapers, but a (comparatively) small colonization force can with some ancient space tech (aka magic) stand a proper chance.

Without some massive handwaves there would be no Reapers by the time the colonization force gets to Andromeda, much less back as the cycle would be long over and the galaxy simply waiting for the next harvest.

That's true. The timing wouldn't really work.

Hmm, at the risk of being banished to the Scary Door maybe The reverse might be more feasible perhaps? You spend the first 2 acts of the game setting up your colony and fighting or befriending these Khet things, then lo and behold the Collector ship arrives loaded with.husks of all the council species under the command of Collector General Shepard. The cycle was completed, the Milky Way is an empty waste and the Reapers are back in.hibernation after ordering an indoctrinated Shepard to go take care of that last colony of stragglers.

A bit dark, and highly unlikely to actually happen, but it would at least resolve Shepherds arc and raise the narrative stakes as you would be defending the last humans in existence. It would also be more believable to defeat one collector ship with fancy Remnant tech than the whole Reaper Armada. You would also be able to talk down a Destroy Shepard, but be forced to kill a Synthesis one.

I'm just spitballing here, trying to see a way that this ark thing (assuming it's not bullshit ) might have something worthwhile.

Eryri wrote:

Raistlin Majere wrote:

Eryri wrote:

dorktainian wrote:https://twitter.com/The1Wynn/status/552631957704941568

It's looking more like Andromeda.

by Eryri Today at 21:19  " The only way I would have an interest in this, is if the colonists in Andromeda amass such a massive arsenal of alien tech that they decided to go back to the Milky Way to fight the Reapers properly, and find an indoctrinated Shepard waiting for them."

Feasible?

Probably not in terms of lore, as the trip there and back would take too long. It depends on how much Space Magic / Timey Wimey stuff Bioware might be willing to apply. I'll admit I'd be prepared to overlook a fair bit of that though, if it meant resolving Shepard's arc properly.

Even then there would be some serious wallbangers involved.

An entire established galaxy of infrastructure and fleets cant fight the Reapers, but a (comparatively) small colonization force can with some ancient space tech (aka magic) stand a proper chance.

Without some massive handwaves there would be no Reapers by the time the colonization force gets to Andromeda, much less back as the cycle would be long over and the galaxy simply waiting for the next harvest.

That's true. The timing wouldn't really work.

Hmm, at the risk of being banished to the Scary Door maybe The reverse might be more feasible perhaps? You spend the first 2 acts of the game setting up your colony and fighting or befriending these Khet things, then lo and behold the Collector ship arrives loaded with.husks of all the council species under the command of Collector General Shepard. The cycle was completed, the Milky Way is an empty waste and the Reapers are back in.hibernation after ordering an indoctrinated Shepard to go take care of that last colony of stragglers.

A bit dark, and highly unlikely to actually happen, but it would at least resolve Shepherds arc and raise the narrative stakes as you would be defending the last humans in existence. It would also be more believable to defeat one collector ship with fancy Remnant tech than the whole Reaper Armada. You would also be able to talk down a Destroy Shepard, but be forced to kill a Synthesis one.

I'm just spitballing here, trying to see a way that this ark thing (assuming it's not bullshit ) might have something worthwhile.

that could work.

Eryri wrote:

The cycle was completed, the Milky Way is an empty waste and the Reapers are back in.hibernation after ordering an indoctrinated Shepard to go take care of that last colony of stragglers.

I recall a statement by that Wack Walters in a YouTube video were he was specifically asked about what happens next in ME3, possible Post conclusion DLC for ME3 (a'la LTSB)? His answer was something along the lines of "no, it would just be a barren wasteland *with animated expression of nothing there*"

I don't recall the title to search for that video. I am not sure if it was right on launch day or just before it or after that.

Here's that video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=vJm3Vnt5zxI#t=77s

Seems just before launch day.

He says "..obviously I can say it wont be after... because this is the end...that's it... so it will be kind of a boring...sort of just like looking at a wasted that will be the DLC if did after..."

At the time it sort came off as a bad joke, now though makes you wonder if that was really a joke or him letting slip the real state of affairs post ME3 according his "lore"

it's the ending that fucks everything up unless you take IT into account.

But seriously, what are the odds of this leak being right? I'm fine with just about all of it, besides being in another fucking galaxy.

God damn it, now I'm having a fucking relapse into thinking that we'll NEVER have a satisfying conclusion to what the fuck happened after ME3's ending and it's pissing me off.
Fuck you Bioware, I'll burn your houses down with the lemons.

chill.  We know it's Shepard in the N7 uniform in the ME4 trailer hudson gave us before he left/quit/was sacked (not some fucktarded ark uniform).  It can only be Shepard.  He's N7.

Oh wait.  What if they changed their minds after casey 'all your choices matter' left?

"a whole new region of space"

Fuck.

its well known only Shepard wears N7 armor

Honestly I hope the gaming industry turns things around. I've made this rant before, but a lot of the things that piss gamers off are done becuase of execs...bisnuess men who want to as per usual find more ways to make money. When some of these bisnuess men take popular stances when push comes to shove they won't do a thing about it. The continue to do this becuase marketing wise, they really don't try to sell to mature gamers, mostly the go for the younger teenaged gamers, who act In puerile fanboyisim or just don't care cuase it isn't their money they have to spend. It's sad, Mass Effect has one of the best stories ever made and some of the greatest characters, but the only way it'd ever get the widespread recognition that it deserves is if it was a sucessful film franchise or television show. It's becuase it's a game, it won't be taken as seriously by the vast majority of pepole. I wish we could go back to the days where iit was left to the hands of the developers and all publishers would do is make sure it gets into people's hands. Right now games are still seen as toys and that's largely the fault of the industry itself. However, this whole by the numbers way of creating something is plaguing every entertainment industry right now. Except for possibly TV though I am seeing more shows that try to mimic the formula of some groundbreaking shows.

windsurfing wrote:Lol yes do you know that QEC theories at it's current state have verifiable data to support the notion that faster than light communication of the classic type is not possible? Therefore what was shown in ME was pure fiction of communication in real time between star systems when illusive man was talking to you from his station in some other star system while you are several light years away from his hide out.

I don't want to get tangled up in this whole argument, but I need to address this.

AFAIK, and anyone correct me if I'm wrong, but QEC is not "faster than light communication". The way I understand it, is that if two particles are in quantum entanglement, they will mirror each other's movements, no matter the distance between them. It's not like there's an energy that has to travel through the quantum field in order to communicate the movement of the other particle, it happens instantaneously, real time, in perfect (a-)symmetry. This way it would theoretically be possible to communicate in binary by manipulating one particle (and observing the other particle on the other end), instantly and across limitless distances. I don't know how much of this is theoretical, but this is how I understand it to work. IIRC, last year they were trying quantum entanglement communication in a research project of some Dutch University. I might have even posted a link here, not sure.

Again, correct me if I'm wrong.