(XL) Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark IV!

ZerebusPrime wrote:No no no... those are the works of... Machine Cultists!



Huh.  I think I have a new term for Synthesizers.

N7 Master Commander John Shepard 117




We squander eons in the darkness, while you seize our triumphs for your own.

We return, and you will rise.

Yeah, Banshee made that first one. As far as I understand, Harbinger's voice actor also played some character in Halo 4, and Banshee used those Halo 4 lines with some ME3 ending footage. I've never really played Halo though, so it's all lost on me.

Yes, they're both the same voice actor. In Halo 4, he is the antagonist, the Didact, of the Promethians.

Also, Keith David played the Arbiter in Halo 2 and 3, who I *think* is rumored to return in Halo 5.

I rather prefer Keith David as Keith David a la Saints Row IV.

ZerebusPrime wrote:I rather prefer Keith David as Keith David a la Saints Row IV.

To be fair, Keith David basically plays Keith David in everything, even when he's playing Keith David as an alien.

TurianRebel212 wrote:

Hanako Ikezawa wrote:Of all the concept arts, I have to say this one is the most interesting to me:

Oh.... .Look, it's DarkSpace.


Ze Reapez are dead and defeated tho right, lol.

Yeah, all of these concept arts (minus the Citadel-like one) reminded me of something Vigil said:

SHEPARD: How do the Reapers survive out in dark space?
VIGIL: We have only theories. The researchers here came to believe the Reapers enter prolonged states of inactivity to conserve energy. This allows them to survive the thousands and thousands of years it takes for organic civilization to rebuild itself, but in this state they are vulnerable. By retreating beyond the edges of the galaxy they ensure no one will accidentally discover them, they keep their existence hidden, until the Citadel relay is activated.

It would be pretty awesome if the next game takes us to dark space to truly defeat the Reapers, but (unfortunately) it's highly unlikely that will happen.

I hope we go to darkspace and really find out about the Reapers and stuff. I don't buy Leviathan's little history lesson for a minute. Nope.

TurianRebel212 wrote:I hope we go to darkspace and really find out about the Reapers and stuff. I don't buy Leviathan's little history lesson for a minute. Nope.

ah yes... reapers.

TurianRebel212 wrote:I hope we go to darkspace and really find out about the Reapers and stuff. I don't buy Leviathan's little history lesson for a minute. Nope.

Me neither.

If the next game doesn't explain or elaborate on a few things from the first 3 games, but instead gives us a totally disconnected story arc, or a clean slate, I'll be starting to believe Hudson left because EA thwarted their storytelling plans.

Which wouldn't even be outrageous or anything, seeing how BW messed up things with ME3. It sure puts EA in a position to demand a few things, doesn't it?

smash016 wrote:

TurianRebel212 wrote:I hope we go to darkspace and really find out about the Reapers and stuff. I don't buy Leviathan's little history lesson for a minute. Nope.

Me neither.

If the next game doesn't explain or elaborate on a few things from the first 3 games, but instead gives us a totally disconnected story arc, or a clean slate, I'll be starting to believe Hudson left because EA thwarted their storytelling plans.

Which wouldn't even be outrageous or anything, seeing how BW messed up things with ME3. It sure puts EA in a position to demand a few things, doesn't it?

Yep. I actually think EA is making them make another Mass Effect game. Hudson and pals vision was only for 3 games. From start to finish. Mass Effect was suppose to be 3 games in an interwoven Narrative and storyline about the Reapers and the Shepard saga, which I guess, it did well to a certain degree. This 4th game being made by a new studio, new director, new writer, new everything just screams EA shill too me. But... I figure if I lower my standards enough maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised.

Yeah, we all have the same worry.

I find it incredibly hard to have hope that all the PR is just bullshit.

Like fshep says, going to dark space and taking the fight to the Reapers for real, it's a really great idea, and you have to wonder why the devs wouldn't, because most people would love this. Not to mention getting Shepard out of the rubble.

What amazes me most is that Weekes was speaking about 'foreshadowing pretty heavily that this was the end of Shepard', even though in reality they didn't foreshadow that at all. What they did foreshadow was that Shepard wasn't dead, that he would come back, that we had to believe that this wasn't the end, but just a test. I mean we've all found the mountains of references.

It's hard to believe that was all coincidence. Or maybe it wasn't but, you know... "plans change". Even though Citadel, which was full of those references, was released way after the "plans change" statement.

It's really grating to still be left in the dark almost three years later, and for a foreseeable time to come still.

What fans want, huh. Apparently fans want to forget about Shepard and the endings, and they want something fresh.

Not me. I still feel like we were left with a lingering promise, a cliffhanger.

"Hang in there." was one of those early tweets, before they suddenly stopped hinting IT stuff. Why did it stop? Because they were giving away too much? Or because "plans change"?

I guess it'll still be a while before we know.

When and how exactly did they say "plans change?"

Priestly, at some point during the DLC cycle, I think a few weeks before the release of Leviathan, made a big post on the BS.N.

I have no link, sorry.

But you know, Priestly said a lot of BS. So much so that at some point nobody believed anything he said, even when later it turned he spoke the truth for once. (Like when he said Citadel DLC would not expand upon the endings)

You don't need more proof that plans changed from real I.T to the hogwash we got at the end of ME3, it's all revealed in the Final Hours app. That's what they had in mind but they changed it because ego maniacs like Hudson and Walters apparently decided it was best to make a less "video gamey" ending, whatever that means.

In any corporation once the damage is done everyone tows the party line because at the end of the day it was a "company" decision on the franchise. Hudson leaving can be interpreted as many things, people telling him to step aside for the damage he did? may well be. We will probably never get the whole picture, who's idea was it to drop I.T in favor of this bullcrap we got?, was it Hudson or Mac Walters? Maybe it's mostly Hudson?

Bioware realizes they have goofed up but they cant go all out and say Hudson left because he felt responsible for what has happened. They have worked with the man for all these years, for them it's business, as a person he maybe completely a different guy and they were all one big family, a real team through all of it. Lets not forget Hudson gave direction for ME1 and ME2 before ME3, we all loved ME1 for what it was. These things colleagues don't forget over the endings. We are just fans, they all worked together and are far more closer and have stronger bonds.

Still damage done is damage done and someone has to take ownership. I am pretty sure Hudson leaving has a lot to do with the state of ME3. One selfish lapse in judgement results in all this mess.

Coming back to the hype and talk about the next game, it is more and more clear now there is no IT, not anymore, there is no secret Shepard reveal, they completely want to dissociate themselves from the original trilogy and win new fans even if it means alienating the hardcore fanbase who are loyal to the original lore and what makes Mass Effect, well Mass Effect. The story and the Shepard's story is unfinished as it stands today with ME3.

They will find some dumbfounding stupid reason to have an new story which has nothing even as much an Iota to connect with Shepard or anything from that trilogy. A new ME1 version repacked setting the stage for a new trilogy or whatever.

So what are we saying here?
IT is dead?
Because I refuse to believe that they would change their minds about something like IT while they were making ME3's DLC. If that's true then why the hell does Citadel have so many references and blatent hints thrown at us?

IT's not dead yet. Go back to sleep and wait for ME4.

I'm not saying any of that. That's just windsurfing who's saying that.

I guess we're just a little anxious, especially since Hudson's untimely departure and the lack of any exciting news regarding ME4 so far.

Ah, Citadel. Fun times.

Unusual Scores

From: AAA Information Technology Dept.

Commander Shepard,

Here in the arena IT department, we are attempting to isolate a bug in the simulator. The bug causes unusual scores to show up, probably due to a memory leak. We are looking for a competitor who can reliably rack up high scores to serve as a paid consultant for the duration of our tests. We think you would make an excellent baseline!

If you are interested, the aspect that needs testing most is a layout with memory-intensive creatures like the super elite level opponents. Selecting those enemies should help us isolate the leak.

We look forward to working with you.

Virginia Ruojian
Principal Systems Administrator
Armax Arsenal Arena

I'm sure Bioware were fully aware of the double meaning of the phrase IT when it comes to Mass Effect when they put the Citadel DLC together. They could have easily used a phrase like Tech Support or Simulation Control, but no, they chose to use IT to send messages to Shepard.

ElSuperGecko wrote:Ah, Citadel.  Fun times.

Unusual Scores

From: AAA Information Technology Dept.

Commander Shepard,

Here in the arena IT department, we are attempting to isolate a bug in the simulator. The bug causes unusual scores to show up, probably due to a memory leak. We are looking for a competitor who can reliably rack up high scores to serve as a paid consultant for the duration of our tests. We think you would make an excellent baseline!

If you are interested, the aspect that needs testing most is a layout with memory-intensive creatures like the super elite level opponents. Selecting those enemies should help us isolate the leak.

We look forward to working with you.

Virginia Ruojian
Principal Systems Administrator
Armax Arsenal Arena

I'm sure Bioware were fully aware of the double meaning of the phrase IT when it comes to Mass Effect when they put the Citadel DLC together.  They could have easily used a phrase like Tech Support or Simulation Control, but no, they chose to use IT to send messages to Shepard.

It's not just the IT mention. It's the whole thing that seems to have a double meaning. Just the way it's written.

Super elite level opponents which are 'memory intensive' creatures. Haha.

A bug in the simulator that causes 'unusual scores' to show up, due to a 'memory leak'.

ElSuperGecko wrote:
I'm sure Bioware were fully aware of the double meaning of the phrase IT when it comes to Mass Effect when they put the Citadel DLC together.  They could have easily used a phrase like Tech Support or Simulation Control, but no, they chose to use IT to send messages to Shepard.

A simple case of looking for what one wants to see?

IT or Information Technology is industry standard reference for anything to do with Computing and the technologies associated with it. Tech support is only one aspect of an IT dept in any company. "Support" being the operating word here. IT depts are primarily in charge of pushing for new technologies that increase productivity of the company. They do everything from recommendations, approvals to installation and maintenance (Support). Many IT depts even develop their own home grown software-hardware solutions because no one else has it in the market ready made for them. All part of working in the IT industry.

Games industry works just like any other IT industry in general. The software development processes are all part of any IT company. Games are software put to use for a certain purpose, entertainment. If you work for Bioware or any studio it is just part of daily work routine to use industry terms and similar jargon. Any reference to IT is not automatically about IndocTheory just because it is from Bioware.

Armax Arsenal is a company that wants to provide entertainment services on the citadel, no real hidden meaning there if they have a dedicated IT dept for their needs. The danger for any theory is when we start taking totally unconnected things out of context just to fit it in with the theory.

TBH Citadel didn't have any tangible 'I.T' themes unlike Levi or maybe even omega. It was just over the top fan service with an outplace short story line about the clone. Fun? sure, I.T? Nah.

I am interested in the so called major I.T references that happened in Citadel DLC because I never felt them, unlike Leviathan DLC.

The Citadel DLC was absolutely crawling with "this can't be real" moments. While that in and of itself isn't direct evidence of ongoing indoctrination on its own, the implications are still unsettling.

ZerebusPrime wrote:The Citadel DLC was absolutely crawling with "this can't be real" moments.  While that in and of itself isn't direct evidence of ongoing indoctrination on its own, the implications are still unsettling.

In a time of war, you pull up and take a vacation on the Citadel. Not only do you take a vacation, you find out you've been cloned, you get shot at, your ship gets stolen, you hunt down and kill your clone, then you all go back to your apartment and have a jolly good party.

In the middle of the war to end all wars.

Meantime you can go shooting reapers in the armax arena... oh and don't forget awakened collectors.

Seems legit.